1) Oregon - I am looking for someone who would be willing to watch my children 5 days a week for 6-9 hours a day. The hours would be anywhere from 5am-2pm and would vary depending on the day. I have a 4 year old and a 6 year old so I would like someone who would do different activities with them like going to the park or doing arts and crafts and someone who could walk/drive my daughter to school in the morning if needed (the school is only a block from our house). I will pay $20.00 a day depending on hours (negotiable). Please email your resume to me with references (required) and I will call you to set up a time to meet our family.
Porky Pig Exposed wrote: Hi I saw your ad on Craigslist and wanted to know if you accidentally typed $20 per day? If it was not an accident, then this is definitely CL-WTF material. You do realize you get what you pay for and your children will be in my prayers because God knows what kind of ''Nanny'' would accept such horrible pay. Would you work full-time hours for twenty dollars? You will get the bottom of the barrel type of care. A non-reliable, irresponsible, low quality care. I wouldn't trust it.
Oregon Response: First off you have no right emailing me to tell me what I should or should not pay for child care. Second of all if you read the ad you would have seen it said depending on the hours. Not that it is any of your business but they would be working on average 2 hours a day and I think 20 dollars for 2 hours of work is a very fair price concidering most daycares only charge $3.00 a kid an hour. Not only that but my kids do not now nor will they ever need YOUR prayers. I take very good care of my kids and I know what is best for them and I would NEVER leave them with someone I didnt feel was reliable and good to my kids and I would also not leave someone alone with my children unless I had done a full back ground check on them. So next time you go and open your mouth about something you know nothing about maybe you should look into it a little more rather then assume you know the whole story.
Porky Pig Exposed: I never said you were not a good mom, of course you will give them good care because they're yours, which is why paying a decent amount for someone taking care of them is important because you get what you pay for. Your ad says 5 days a week, 6-9 hours a day. NOT 2 hours. So my assumptions are based on your words. Second of all, daycares are completely different, they charge less per child because there's alot of children. So $3 dollars plus 10 children would be about $30 an hour. Nannies are a luxury that not many can afford, they come to you, give your child one-on-one care, bring your child to outings, etc. They don't just sit a kid in front of a TV all day. All I'm trying to say is, if you pay low, you get low care. Also if you meant $20 for 2 hours, you should probably write that in your ad so you don't attract low class people.
Oregon Response: Thanks but no thanks for your advice. I think I can handle this on my own.
Porky Pig Exposed: Hope so. Good luck!
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2) Virginia - I am looking for someone to come to our home 2-3 times per week (M/W/F) usually between 8:30-3:30. Our daughter is 1 year old. Bringing another child or two is acceptable. Someone who speaks Spanish or knows Sign Language is preferred. (We probably won't consider you if you do not do one of those). I have just started a business and for now we can pay up to $100/week. Please reply to this ad if interested. Thank you for your interest.
Porky Pig Exposed wrote: Hi I saw your ad on Craigslist and wanted to say that anyone willing to accept such a low rate is not someone I'd want around my infant. Shame on you. You get what you pay for and if you can't afford a good quality nanny then you can't have one. A Nanny is a luxury which is why not everyone has one, usually the upper class/wealthy have nannies because they can afford the going rate.
Virginia Response - For ur info i did hire one so myob!
Porky Pig Exposed: You hired someone that fast? Wow, your even more ridiculous then I previously thought. Anyone willing to take $50 dollars for 40 hours is someone that you're going to regret hiring because you're so concerned about getting the cheapest deal that you don't even realize your putting your kids in harms way. It's sad that a complete stranger is more worried about your child then you are. Don't go crying to the police when your house gets burned down because your nanny over-dosed and passed out while on the job. Or if you child gets abused emotionally, verbally, physically or sexually. Some parents are too clueless to breed. The only spanish speaking ''Nanny'' you'll get is an illegal for the price your willing to offer. And the illegal won't be high quality, probably someone desperate for a job under the table. I understand you can't afford more money but then again, having a nanny is a luxury and upper-class/wealthy people are usually the ones who have good quality nannies while the low-class people, like yourself, hire people that I wouldn't trust in a million years to be alone with my children. Don't expect too much for that price. You get what you pay for.
Virginia Response - Thank you, Porky Pig for your response. I certainly appreciate your input, but you are very sadly mistaken with your assumptions. I understand your point of view, but posted my ad anyway in hopes that I might get someone who was looking to help a working family out. We are by NO means low class! My husband and I both work very hard to earn a very good living. Because I just started a business, we are being much more conscious and responsible with our money. I don't even really know why I'm explaining myself to you... I've gotten a tremendous response to my ad from many generous people who have offered to provide us with the care we need... within our posted budget! In the future when you have an opinion about something, it would be nice to use your real name so that people can take you and your opinions more seriously.
Porky Pig Exposed: It's great that you're looking to budget. How about budgeting in other areas. It just disappoints me that parents want to budget with there children, what should be the most important people in there lives. I budget with many things, we all do, but when it comes to children, they're worth alot more then what you're trying to offer someone. That will only get you a resentful, unreliable, irresponsible type of caregiver. Good Nannies make anywhere between $10-$20per HOUR even as high as $30 in some states. I know this is Craigslist and the quality and offers are going to be lower compared to higher-class sites like Care and SitterCity, but it's still upsetting. Good luck in your search and I hope you screen really good. But you can't say I didn't warn you. Oh and btw, my opinions are being taken quite seriously, or else you wouldn't of emailed me back trying to explain yourself. Nice try though, lol, have a great day.
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3) Arizona - Nanny/Sitter needed with OPEN AVAILABILITY!! Hi I am seeking childcare in my home at Val Vista and Broadway in Mesa. The hours I work are pretty set since I now work 2 jobs (teacher and waitress). You will be needed Monday through Friday for sure. Weekend days will be optional. The kids are VERY easy going. They love arts and crafts, singing, dancing, and outside time, so we would love someone young, energetic, and a kid at heart! I have only been back to work for a short time after staying home with the kids so I can only afford $20 per day TO START. If we click then I would be willing to pay to have you CPR/First Aid certified! I would prefer someone in MY home. Since I mainly work nights it would be nicer to not have to wake the kids to bring them home. Especially since my daughter will be starting school, a bed time routine is a must! You would be needed from 2-3pm to anywhere from 930-11pm. Since I’ve just begun the serving job the hours aren’t set. Some nights may be shorter than others while others may be longer. Just to be sure, flexibility is a MUST! Please email me if interested and hopefully we can meet soon! I will respond as soon as possible! We MUST meet before Friday!!!
Porky Pig Exposed: Hi I was wondering if you're still searching for a nanny to employ? If so, I'm not surprised, what self respecting nanny would work for $20 a day? A full days shift, at that. What an insult, not only to nannies, but to your own children. You're expecting the moon and the stars but paying less then three bucks an hour. Hah, good luck, you're going to need it. You're a teacher and a waitress yet you could work at Burger King and still afford more, just like a nanny can work at Burger King and get paid more. Wait, let me guess, you got bills right? Because you're the only one in the world with family and bills right? WRONG. And you wrote you must need care before friday, so your rushing. You're a horrible, irresponsible, cheap parent and I feel bad for your children. I would never budget childcare, these are children we're talking about, not materialisic things, CHILDREN! Shame on you.
Arizona Response: Wow, fuck you!
112 comments:
Ummm, I don't know where to start....
Wait, yes I do.
And here I thought I had balls. Apparently Porky Pig's balls are bigger than mine! lol
HAHAHAHA!! This is something some of us have always wanted to do but never had the nerve! Some of those parents are out of their damn mind with what they're offering in wages. Good for you Porky, lol. Jeez, what a name!
th-th-th-that's all folks! lmao!
Love it!
Porky Pig is right on the money. There are legal, licensed, affordable and safe daycares everywhere yet many parents choose otherwise. You most certainly get what you pay for and when one declines to place their child in a legit environment that is governed by laws and state mandates in lieu of whoever answers a Craigslist ad is certainly begging for trouble. People CAN afford good childcare, they just choose not to.
I don't understand why some parents look down on daycares and insist on a "nanny" that they obviously can't afford.
Anon:
Where did PP say she hoped something horrible happened to these children and families? I am not sure of what you read, but I read something different.
I have been in the field of early childhood education for 14 years. My first position as an assistant teacher, paid $7.50 in 1998. I enjoyed working for the company, and moved to my second position a year later, making a little more than what I previously made. Throughout the years, I learned how to carefully pick and choose where I wanted to work, and I now work where my career began so to speak, as the company I work for bought out the center where my career began.
Have you ever been paid such a ridiculous wage and treated like shit by your boss? I have been there twice, and it bites. You dread going to work, seeing your bosses vehicle, hearing their voice and looking at their face. You silently pray they will leave for the day, as you feel like you can't breathe when they are around. Payday is your favorite day, even though you may not get paid much; you are working there because you need the money, not because you like it there.
IMO, PP did her best to let these families know her opinion on their offered rate of pay. If she didn't do it, someone else would have done it. Her point was valid: offer low rate of pay, get low quality care in return.
i admire PP for standing up to these cheap people - but - for her own credibility she should tone it down and stick with facts, not name calling - once the name calling starts that will destroy the parent's open mind to learn a better budgeting way
hope to see more of this
Oh this cracked me up so much! Especially Arizona's reply! Porky, were you bored this day? You know that pointing out logic to these people is not going to make a difference. They (likely) have all hired people for these paltry wages and are perfectly happy with their (likely) sub-par care.
an interesting question here is - is porky perusing the CL for the purpose of getting a job? or - on the look out for idiots to have a little fun lambasting them to no other real purpose other than getting their goat?
If porky or anyone else were looking on CL for a "nanny " job there may be another way
ie -
" Dear Mrs Smith:
I am a nanny looking for work. I am afraid your ad is actually for a very inexpensive babysitter but i am answering anyway ;0) because your kids sound awesome !
My rate for the very experienced care i provide is X and my requirements are Y
My education is Z and the unique activities i plan with children are awesome and you may want to hear about it
i have a perfect record background in credit/driving/criminal etc
I am mary poppins / supernanny / all rolled up into one, i have excellent references
i do charge the usual NANNY rate as i am a NANNY not a temp babysitter
with very much due respect - the extremely budget rates will most likely result in temporary babysitters who may not meet the demands worthy of your awesome kids
best wishes - and when you get tired of the rest - contact me - the best !!
yours truly"
lambasting these people may provide some venting and getting emotional blowing up on a blog may help pop that cork sometimes
but maybe there is a way to educate these people!
Thank you for porky for pointing out ridiculous people, and their own ridiculous expectations of a proper "nanny" salary. I really wish professional nannies were regulated in this country and that it was common knowledge that it is a luxury to hire a professional full time Nanny. I also wish that this country allowed for quality professional AFFORDABLE day care. Most people look at the price of a day care and cannot believe how expensive it is. They search other options and usually come across an article about how affordable a Nanny can be. Most of the bad sightings on this site are from affordable "nannies." It baffles me that people who cannot afford daycare look in to getting a "nanny." This is like saying I can't afford to go out to eat but i will look into hiring a professional chef to cook my meals in my home for me. CRAZY.
I love you, Porky Pig. <3
@Porky Pig:
You rock!
I couldn't stop cracking up when I read your responses...you are right on the money honey $$ and these parents are crazy. I don't believe for a minute that they had "high quality" nannies respond.
And the last response...the "F" bomb...priceless.
I look forward to more of your CL-WTF ads (and responses..I hope!) Porky Pig.
RBTC, while you *might* find a good response with that sort of email, you are more likely to get a bunch of people telling you you're crazy for charging that much, that nannying isn't a real job and that if they wanted to pay exorbitant prices, they'd go with daycare. Believe me, I've heard it all.
Almost every single CL WTF post is submitted by Porky Pig, and now this? While I agree that many ads posted on CL offer insulting and low wages, the best thing to do is just not reply. Sending a nasty e-mail telling them how cheap they are and what a horrible parent they are is not going to make them pay more. Porky Pig needs to find another hobby and grow up.
I like Porky's hobby. Since were the ones choosing to read it, we must not have something better to do, ourselves. :D
This is disturbing, sophmoric, and classist to the highest degree. Some people just can't afford a high priced nanny. There is no need to berate them, especially if the only thing "unreasonable" about them is their budget.
Shame on you, Porky Pig. Why are we applauding this moronic troll?
"Don't go crying to the police if you child is molested" WTF?!?!? This needs to be banned.
mannah - i go thru it every day - out of work people use my industry's words, titles etc
clients will say - but i can get it for 1/4 that price on craigs list
associates of mine who castigate these clients " you are cheap, you are a moron, you will hire a molester etc. " - they do not get the client
i patiently explain to these people the ins and outs of the industry, the accurate terms - the correct values -they keep my info and --come back, after they try the rest then they want the best
however - i see your point also because a good nanny like you guys only goes thru that process every once in a while - i go thru it multiple times per day
I'm kind of glad Porky did this and it was quite entertaining, although I do believe some things could've been toned down some, or better worded (I wouldn't call someone I didn't know a horrible parent). She had good points - just expressed in a hard-to-receive manner at times.
That said, I want to see more!
*I loved how the Virginia lady had two completely different styles of response, haha. Txt speeeK vs. elaborate with use of proper grammar. Then, had the nerve to bring up taking people seriously :eye roll:
*I hear the previous posters and understand that people have budgets, but come on... $20/day is insulting and ridiculous. They ought to be ashamed for offering someone that as a living wage (rather than being ashamed of not being able to afford a nanny).
::Monikers are free. It only takes a moment (if your lucky) to make up one. If you value your opinion and wish to share it with the rest of us, get one or your comment will be deleted::
REPOST -
This is really mean. Yes, these advertisements are ridiculous and yes people should pay more if they expect quality care. It's one thing to criticize on this board-- I think sites like this one help call out bad employer practices. I agree that there are a lot of people that treat nannies poorly. But contacting random strangers and saying you hope something horrible happens to them is really low. Especially people who can't afford good childcare but don't have any options other than to go to work and find someone to watch their children. Shame on YOU.
That's what happens with you pay prices that attract the bottom feeders. Think about this, WHO would work for $20 a day???? Someone who can't get a job that requires a drug & background check. The druggies & people with criminal pasts are attracted to these jobs. Nobody else, not even a fastfood place will hire them. I bet a lot of these trashy women invite their boyfriends over while they're babysitting. They shouldn't be banned for saying the truth. The parent is putting their child in a high risk situation.
Its not that they can't afford a high priced nanny. Its that they choose not to pay a legal & minimum wage. There is nothing wrong with not being able to afford a nanny. Nothing about Porky's post gave me the impression she(or he) looked down upon those seeking a nanny in exchange for chump change, BECAUSE they couldn't afford one. She was simply pointing out the facts that #1 They're not offering enough compensation #2 That they should consider daycare #3 That they're putting their children in a high risk situation.. I don't think its sophmoric because I believe these parents are truly cluess. With the economy being so bad, some parents act like nannys should be grateful for a job, any job, regardless of whether or not it pays enough for them to survive. I think more people should be OUTRAGED that some people have the nerve to expect for a nanny to provide safe & enriching one-on-one care for what was minimum wage over twenty years ago!!!!!
RIDICULOUS: MOST OF US ENJOY READING CLWTF ESPECIALLY WHEN SOMEONE WRITES TO THE PARENTS.ITS MY FAVORITE THING TO READ ON ISYN
ARE YOU ONE OF THESE PARENTS TRYING TO GET LOW CARE? LOL PARENTS GET SO OFFENDED WHEN THE TRUTH IS SPOKEN.
CAPLOCK IS NOT WORKING SO DONT ASK LOL.
I think Porky Pig did a great service by writing these leeches back. For the record...yes, they are horrible parents. Any parent who would hire someone to watch their child at such a low wage, thus putting the child in extreme danger, is horrid in my book.
I think it is about time someone put these scum bag parents back in their places.
Who knows?
She might just make ONE parent realize the dangerous behavior they are doing and in realizing the error of their ways, get them to see reality.
Stop drinking haterade people.
Lol @ Amy. Everyone needs a hater! :P
I think Porky did a good service. I've totally done it before, too.
Really!? We are applauding porky pig? I get the ads are ridiculous and who would ever apply to them? But to sit there and actually take the time to reply to the ads? To tell a parent their house can burn down or their child will get abused sexually, physically, etc is so beyond sick I can't even think how demented porky pig is. The world can be a rough place.... Let us not encourage crazy behavior. Offering low pay is one thing. Shake your head when reading the ad and move on. To take the time and respond to these ads is another thing. I can't believe this would even make it on this site.
Katie, I agree some of the things porky said (i.e., the house burning down, the sexual abuse) was a bit extreme but I honestly think the majority of these parents are totally clueless! Maybe one of the e-mails porky sent changed a parents mind? If thats the case, perhaps one of those kids lives won't be put into danger by the parents allowing the dregs of society into their home. Who else would accept $20 a day for a full 8hr shift? Its complete madness in my opinion!
This entire thread sickens me. Porky, get a life.
Porky needs to put down the donuts and get a hobby. Shame on you.
What Porky Pig did was a great public service for children. Unfortunately, young children cannot advocate for themselves yet and it is obvious that their parents could give a hoot, etc.
By responding to this crazy ads, and confronting these ignorant parents, I think this is a great thing. Why? Because if just ONE (hopefully all) of these parents opens their minds up and realizes that Porky Pig has a point, then perhaps she is saving a life or two.
Really. Only a drug abuser/sex offender/murderer will accept a job that only pays $20 for 6-9 hours.
Come on people. Use your heads.
You can make an effort to educate parents who are either unwilling or unable to afford nanny care, or you can try to upset and embarrass them and put them on the defensive. I think PP has the right idea, but is approaching CL posters in the wrong way.
Just as an example, I would have responded to the first ad as follows:
Dear parents,
As a professional nanny, I wanted to take a moment to let you know about some resources that you can use to determine a legal and desirable wage for your new nanny. Both careDOTcom and sittercityDOTcom have babysitter wage calculators. They give lower rates than most nannies would accept, but they are a good place to start.
You may be unaware that minimum wage laws apply to nannies, and that if you need a nanny to work at least 30 hours a week (6 hours a day for 5 days), you will need to pay at the very least $8.80 x 30, or $264 gross per week. The following link discusses nanny wages in far more detail:
http://www.4nannies.com/nanny-wages/
A nanny is the most costly form of childcare. If a nanny is not a luxury you can afford, the next lowest cost option is an Au Pair (~$300/week for up to 45 hours, and she lives in your home). Beneath that in cost is traditional daycare or 24 hour availability daycare, and the lowest cost option is a family daycare home, where a woman charges a lower rate to care for other family's kids in her home.
Best of luck finding excellent and responsible care for your children that fits your family budget!
Sincerely,
Tales
Come on guys there is a time and place to say something. As a parent and previous nanny myself, I understand both sides. I have always paid our nannies accordingly and treated them like family. But to respond to an ad in such a malicious way is not helping the situation. It is only upsetting the parent and causing drama. If you want to get your point across, learn how to say something in a way somebody will listen. Only angering somebody randomly in an email is not the way to do it. There are better ways to make your point heard. If you want to be an advocate for children and their rights, then by all means go to school, get an education, and learn how to say something in ways people will really listen. Lesson number one.... To approach randomly and attack another by listing gruesome things that could happen to one's child will only make a parent or guardian defensive and tuned out. RBTC..... Obviously you know how to write a better email. Maybe porky should take lessons from you.
And tales.....yes obviously you know how to write a better email. Most of these parents are ignorant or probably really clueless about the pay. Nicely putting it much better than attacking another. We all should be voices for keeping children out of danger, but learn how to say it!
katie - what i am starting to realize is that there are alot of really really angry nannies out there. They are not being treated right and the economy is destroying their salary base - this site has become a lighting rod spot for them to kind of pop the gasket so to speak and blow up
As far as being treated right, that is hard because if a family is crum bums - no contract will help really - it's a matter of intuition/ discernment based on experience
as for the money issue - i have bad news, that is not going to get better - i am making less money than i was 5 years ago, so is my brother.
Belt tightening is going to be the way of the world pretty much forever
getting mad, blowing up at people on a blog will accomplish nothing - the great nannies need to become very proactive to as you said - LEARN HOW TO MAKE PEOPLE LISTEN - not just throw out pejorative/emotional words and phrases which accopmlish nothing
ps - i thought i was a former nanny but maybe not - i never did the complex activities they talk,about on here in the 80's - i played withthem, went to the park and for walks, but i did not have childcare education, did not plan lengthy craft sessions, rarely drove them anywhere, never implemented behavior modification terms requirements - so maybe i was not a nanny
the people that have these qualifications need to learn how to promote themselves with no hard feelings - not every body can afford a mercedes benz - some people have to take the smartcar
So, only people who accept a low-paying job could injure, sexually abuse, or neglect children? I don't appreciate porky pig's replies to these ads. I accepted a job once that ended up paying $3 an hour. It was my first (and only) live-in job, and I didn't know any better. I didn't harm those children just because the parents were terribly cheap. I'm not a child abusing person because I accepted the job. I was young and didn't know better, just like a lot of the people who probably accept these positions. It's an insult to anyone who does accept a low-paying job to assume they wouldn't take adequate care of someone's child(ren). I agree SO MUCH that parents need to pay their nannies well, and that not everyone can afford a nanny, but it doesn't give me any right to judge those who don't pay well. Ugh. Porky pig needs to get a life,
Lol!! GOOD LUCK WITH THAT, MISS ARIES. Too funny.....
Lifts my TEAM PORKY sign up & down while chanting "GO PORKY!"
:D
You're probably the exception to the rule. Its too bad you didn't have an adult in your life advocating for you. I'm sure you were a wonderful nanny.
... only a drug addict would take a job like that? No... a drug addict would just steal a bike real quick to buy a hit.
I have a friend who's a SAHM who would probably take on a job like this, just for a little extra pocket money.
You don't know these people's situations. Maybe they only make $7/hr at their jobs, maybe they have huge bills, maybe they're supporting a family or parent elsewhere. These parents are poor, not evil. They have easygoing expectations and are upfront about the pay. Nobody is tricking anyone into taking these jobs. While I couldn't work for so little, I appreciate the honesty.
I really think this is beyond inappropriate. Porky must be a lonely, lonely person. They also have an awful grasp on grammar and sentence structure, but I digress.
i agree with melissa, i own a successful co now and set my own rates but boy did i pay dues, did the live in thing for no money, $5 buck an hour sitting/waiting on tables,cleaning toilets,mowing lawns
sometimes $5 means the difference between being stranded and enough gas to make it home - the BEST OF THE BEST pay their dues in rough situations moneywise/work environment/wise - and the emplyers who get the deal will never have it as good again!
maybe there is some common ground with porky - it's easy to be vicariously gratified by the pormeister venting some spleen - but as long as porky is taking the time to respond to these people why not educate them
and - ill-wishing is a bad business - for us all - it usually comes back one way or the other
Dear Porky,
When comparing two things, THAN is correct...as in greater or less THAN. Then is a measure of time.
Love,
Moniker
I am 100% Team Porky Pig!! ♥
I am amazed at all the criticism she is receiving on this post.
Us nannies need to stick together and advocate for each other.
Not try to knock each other down.
By saying PP needs to get a life, you guys are basically saying it is okay for people to treat nannies like dirt.
Shame on all of you.
I once took a very low paying job because I absolutely needed the money. It sucked balls.
Of course I didn't abuse the child, she was awesome and it was not her fault that I was in a financial rut, but I was resentful that her parents took advantage of me. I am a great nanny and I feel that I should be compensated accordingly. Of course not everyone who contacts these adds are going to be the scum of the earth, but it is a risk these parents are taking and they need to know that it is NOT okay.
I could just see a pill popping drug addicted "nanny" jumping at the chance at a job that allows her to lay on the couch all day. Where else can you work from the couch & pull in enough cash to buy your pills? And she doesn't have to worry about drug testing. These $20 a day jobs sound like the perfect gig for a druggie.
My ex MIL did respite care out of her own home for a handicapped individual and for a crack addict. The addict, when she wasn't high, was a sweet person who would sit and watch TV and movies with us when she wasn't high. When her SSI check came in the mail, she was gone for days: getting high, sleeping here and there. Crackheads usually sleep in abandoned homes, commonly referred to as "crack houses" or "traps", and even in abandoned buildings. Binges last for a day, sometimes two days, even longer.
Of course, when the binge is over and they wake up down, rather than high, they will do whatever they have to for a hit. I had $20 stolen out of my purse at MIL's house, and I believe the addict did it. My ex wasn't too happy about what she did, yet he and I both understood her addiction is a disease.
There is a fantastic book entitled "A Piece Of Cake" by Cupcake Brown, a former drug addict, prostitute and gang member turned lawyer, author and speaker. Prior to entering rehab and obtaining soberity (she has been sober for over 20 years now) she worked in several law offices as a secretary for one purpose.
To get high, stay high and be high for as long as she could. She even went to work high.
Addiction, especially crack or heroin, is hard to break. It sucks you in something fierce. A friend of mine recently lost her sister at the age of 29 to a heroin addiction.
Still think addicts won't take a job to get high and come to work high? Read "A Piece of Cake" and think again.
Tales and RBTC are correct. Trying to "educate" people about nanny salaries by lowering yourself to insults, veiled threats of harm to their children, sarcasm, classist comments, seemingly poor math calculations in #2, and multiple grammar/spelling errors (run on sentences, got/have, than/then, your/you're, there/their, alot/a lot, good/well, of/have, etc -- basically anything not caught by spell check) is not effective.
All it does is make the parents defensive, rather than thoughtful. If I received an email like PP's I would disregard it completely. If I received an email like Tales or RBTC's, I would give it serious thought and engage in a dialogue.
I understand the frustration at clueless parents. Certainly, many of us have felt similar frustration in our own jobs when we have felt overworked and underpaid. But can you imagine sending such poorly written and juvenile emails to a potential employer in ANY other job? If you want the nanny profession to receive the respect it deserves, then treat it as a profession and act like a professional. Writing these kinds of emails, IMO, does nothing but make nannies look immature, uneducated and NOT worthy of the salaries PP is suggesting. You are doing your profession a disservice with your crusade.
There are so many nannies on here who seem incredible. It is a shame to see so many who think this is acceptable adult, professional behavior.
nycmom- find a job for me - i will move ! ok i can't but many of us agree that u are an amazing example of an employer in this biz - or any other - we all agree- keep it up - your edutainment !
I think when the cheapskate parents posted their ads on CL, they were opening up Pandora's Box anyway.
Why are so many of you nannies coming down on Porky Pig? It's as if you guys are condoning cheap childcare which is one of the most common gripes on this blog.
Lissa is right. I'm surprised some of you are upset by this. Maybe PP's approach needs some work but she got the point across either way, right? And theres no way of ever knowing who these people are anyway so I have to wonder why its even an issue. Everywhere, in every state, nannies are underpaid, undervalued and overworked. PP spoke for many of us here and we should at least thank her for standing up for us.
Though I do think that PP could have worded her messages a bit more wisely, and could have done it in a nicer/more efficient manner like some of the above posters were saying I am glad that someone had the guts to actually inform these people that yes a nanny is a costly form of childcare. I've wanted to say similar things multiple times to people not only on CL but on sittercity and careDOTcom as well. Now on CL yes you do have the potential to get scummy people who respond to adds and are willing to accept the crap pay but also have a chance to find wonderful young women who are looking for a way to start out and gain experience. When I took my first nannying gig last summer (off careDOTcom) I got payed a solid $100 a week plus whatever was left over from my outings with the children (MB payed for everything) I was eighteen and did not know any better, but I never harmed the children in any way and did my best to keep them safe and entertained. Even though parents are wrong for not paying minimum wage and offering such terrible wages for a Nanny and should educate themselves on the differences between babysitter, in home daycare's, and nannies there is no reason to belittle the parents instead of educating them.
lambasting and verbally attacking the cl moms because they use the term "nanny" to refer to a choice which they cannot afford and is 100% out of their range price/wise, does not really help the situation
maybe we can all work together to educate these moms - it's an nteresting idea anyway
I get being ticked at these crazy offers. I can even understand writing the parents in anger/frustration. However, if you write them an email like those above, do you think it would change their point of view? Wouldn't it be much more effective to instead post an "ad" on CL in response to the individual families? I think you are much more likely to change the mind of a desperate Nanny who was considering applying than you are to change the mind of someone who thinks it's okay to pay $3 an hour. If that much.
@ Tales: I'm using what you posted above as a post on CL! Because it was wonderfully written and I feel that yes, parents should know. to bad I cant post it on Sittercity and Care as well!
Nycmom, very well said. I didn't want to say anything about Porky Pig's atrocious writing because I knew people would take issue with it, so I'm glad others have pointed it out. People do not pride themselves on their writing skills anymore, which is a shame. They don't see how having poor writing skills just makes them look unintelligent.
BTW, I have posted a "you get what you pay for" type of ad on CL before. It was taken down within 2 hours. Probably because of all the under-paying parents getting pissed that I was calling them out.
I don't agree with everyone assuming that Porky Pigs approach didn't get the parents to think. None of us know that.
The problem is Porky isn't one of the chosen ones in the gang that runs this board now.
Nycmom, Tales, RBTC etc.
If you aren't part of the crew they attack you.
Sorry dear. There are some fantastic nanny boards out on the web. I suggest you seek them out and join them.
I don't understand while you all love NYCMOM so muc.
She has admitted to having less than stellar skills when it comes to hiring caregivers for her children.
She refuses to acknowledge the difference between a sitter and a nanny. Even though the difference has been pointed out to her many times.
She can't understand why a degreed nanny deserves higher pay than one without. Even if they have care experience.
She has admitted to holding her nanny to higher standards than she holds herself to.
She has admitted to going through many nannies , and I believe her oldest is no older than 14 years of age.
She has admitted to being a checklist mom boss.
She has admitted to being a boss that lies about nanny cam use.
She has admitted that her children are out of control.
Sounds exactly like the MBs you all flip out over , but for some reason you love NYCMOM.
Color me confused.
Wow..Eggs you sure have done your homework. LOL.
I couldn't agree more.
I personally cannot stand nycmom's view on nanny cams. She thinks being deceptive to the person who cares for her kids is a-ok.
It isn't.
Tales just likes to be the first to the scene. If she is not first she will find fault with whatever has been previously said.
If you dare correct her or disagree with her she'll adopt a snotty attitude.
This is also true for Mannah.
RBTC though will claim otherwise is a troll looking for nothing more than attention and free advertising for her business.
A business that is doing so well she spends all her time on this website.
She will also pretend not to understand the error of her ways.
Instead of admitting to her wrongs she tends to write 5 page essays full of words I'm certain she does not no the meaning of as she has demonstrated terrible reading comprehension.
Lyn is on the fence. It's as though she wants to be one of the gang , but can't bring herself to be as mean and condescending as they are on a regular basis. In recent posts she has made more effort to be more snarky.
Nycmom will also feign ignorance when it comes to her errors and respond and 13 paragraphs, snd throw in how she is a mature adult and willingto engange in any discussion but never manages to answer anything.
Kudosto you gypsy.
This blog needs more posters like you not afraid to have an oppinion that differs from the howlers.
And what about me Eggs?
Eggs,
I did not see any actual questions you asked me. I always try to respond, assuming I have the time and see the post, to reasonable questions asked of me.
Nonetheless, most of your points are incorrect:
1. She has admitted to having less than stellar skills when it comes to hiring caregivers for her children.
-Actually I have admitted that I was not skilled at employing/hiring as a new mom, but feel I have learned a great deal over the years. I think I am a good employer and manager currently.
2. She refuses to acknowledge the difference between a sitter and a nanny. Even though the difference has been pointed out to her many times.
-Incorrect. I have stated that I do believe there are two different jobs, but that the use of the words nanny/babysitter is generally regional and not always reflective of the actual jobs. I have also said that I *personally* do not get offended when patients assume I work a different job than I do. I have never said it was not valid for nannies to be concerned about the job title or the difference in the jobs.
3. She can't understand why a degreed nanny deserves higher pay than one without. Even if they have care experience.
-Half correct. I do not believe an education is automatically an increased qualification or a desirable trait in a nanny due to my own personal experience. I have always felt that experience is a valid and important credential.
4. She has admitted to holding her nanny to higher standards than she holds herself to.
-Incorrect. I hold my nanny to *different* standards than myself. She is working as a professional nanny when I am paying her. Thus, I expect to be able to give a job description and have her adhere to it. For example, I hire Spanish speaking nannies and my kids are bilingual as a result. I do not speak Spanish and cannot offer this to my children. I do errands while with my kids. I do not expect my nanny to do more than the occasional errand.
5. She has admitted to going through many nannies , and I believe her oldest is no older than 14 years of age.
-Incorrect. I have had a total of 3 long-term nannies. Most recently the change was due to a move. I have only parted ways, mutually and amicably, with one long-term nanny. My oldest is 12yo, but since having kids we have moved cross-country 3 times.
6. She has admitted to being a checklist mom boss.
-What does this even mean?
7. She has admitted to being a boss that lies about nanny cam use.
-Correct. As I have clearly stated many times, I support the use of a hidden, undisclosed nanny cam for the first 1-2 weeks of employing a new nanny with a pre-verbal child. I would not and have never used a cam beyond that time frame.
8. She has admitted that her children are out of control.
-Sigh, another incorrect. I have admitted that my kids are not behaviorally perfect. I am open that my oldest child is challenging. However, none of my kids are "out of my control." None have any behavioral or academic problems in any environment except my oldest at home.
Feel free to apologize for all of your unkind and incorrect deductions if you have the grace and humility to do so.
Nycmom, don't count on it. I'm wondering if Eggs has gotten you and Workingmom mixed up a little bit. Some of the things she was saying seemed to describe WM more than you.
Eggs, I'm just wondering what made you suddenly decide to psycho-analyze all of us. It was really out of the blue, though I have to admit, quite welcome. It gave me a chuckle anyway.
Eggs is dead on about RBTC. Seriously, how many times do we have to be reminded that you are a business owner who started out waitressing tables for $5an hour and how you were called a pedophile and lambasted on here. And wah wah wahhhhh. I cannot stand RBTC and I'm thoroughly annoyed by her need to comment on every single comment that every single person makes. Gypsy, that goes for you too. You don't need to comment on everyone else's comments. Get a life already.
I think you're partially right Eggs. I have been more snarky lately. I don't ever wish to be anything less than helpful and pleasant, in real life or online. But I think lately I've let myself get stressed by personal life and have been getting annoyed easier than I typically do. It stinks and I'll work on it. But I assure you I have no desire or intention to be "one of the gang" in any sense. If people here like me that's wonderful! If not, it's nothing huge to me. I don't alter my personality and comments to fit it. Well, I don't mean to if I occasionally do anyway.
Thanks for pointing out my recent "snark" though. I really do see what you mean and I'll work on it. :)
Congrats, Eggs. You gave me a really good laugh (and I don't mean that in a bad way).
Whoever it was that commented on people commenting on every post, seriously, let it be. It's the internet for crying out loud. You can't restrain them. It's not like she was talking to you anyway; just ignore it. (I personally like reading all the comments - good, bad, & in between)
Finally, lay off, Lyn. She's one of the sweetest people on here from what I've seen.
- Just an old soul
EGGS - LOL SOOO TRUE WHEN YOU SAID 'Instead of admitting to her wrongs she tends to write 5 page essays full of words I'm certain she does not no the meaning of as she has demonstrated terrible reading comprehension.'- THAT MADE ME LOL.
Thanks, for the compliment, eggs! I've never been one to worry about being popular or keeping my unpopular views to myself.
@needyposter
I am not going to argue with you about whether or not I post too much. That's subjective. However, I did a quick search. And I did not respond to four out of the five top topics posted here. Whether or not I agree with you, I respect your opinion & defend your right to it. As far as having a life, if I didn't have one I would be worrying about what perfect strangers are doing online. That is what people who have no life do. :)
Wow..nycmom...no offense, but I always skip over your posts. They are SO darn long and I don't have the time nor patience to read everything you write.
If I did, I would probably choose to go to the library instead and read a book.
Keep it coming porky pig. Love your comments and you don't need to explain or apologize to ANYONE!! ;). Also, I thought Mannah was suppose to take a break for a while? 2 days is NOT long enough. Mannah, keep good on your word and while at it, extend it to a year! LOL hahaha :) WAIT make if a permanent 'break'!
Don't you have something better to do than harass people you don't like? Learn to skip their posts. That's what a normal adult would do. Time to grow up.
GAWD there are some real meanies on this blog! And you all work with children? Please please do not bully your charges the way you bully one another here. It's polluting the blog badly.
No offense @farrah & @loveporky but time to stfu already!
Hi eggs, nice to meetcha! Thanks for the analysis of my posting style and methods. I needed a good snicker today.
No shortage of haters today! If you don't like someone keep it to yourself. Didn't your parents teach you manners? Guess not. How sad. I feel sorry for you. It must suck being so hateful. You're also setting a bad example for your charges. I bet you act this immature IRL too.
hehe good one!
Just an old soul you claim lyn is one of the sweeter people on here?! No wonder you're an old soul. You don't seem to have a good memory. Lol. I you said MPP yes, but Lyn?! Ms. Snarky larky ? No. Get your facts straight. Eggs even had to let Lyn know she was getting too snarky for her own good!
Haha! Soooo true!!
I nvr read her posts. Blah blah blah blah is what I see. Same with nycm blah blah blah blah.
Snarky Larky? Sigh... I really shouldn't respond to this. It goes against my better moral judgment. But I really have NO idea what you are referring to.
La Ancanita: Thanks for your kind words. :)
Sounds like somebody is on here too much. Try taking your own advice for a change.
omg. Stop trying to control everyone. Be an adult for once in your life. Lyn isn't snarky. You're just looking for fights with anyone & everyone here. Get a hobby.
Didn't almost all of us start working at minimum wage? My parents did. I did. Almost everyone I know did. What's the big deal? Why do some people bring it up that they made $5 an hour at least once a week??? Do they think they are the only ones who made minimum wage???
omg. Stop trying to control everyone and be real. . Be an adult for once in your life. Lyn is snarky. You need to just start trying to let anyone &everyone here know the truth. Keep It real, unlike Mannah you have a productive hobby.
Haha stfu huh? Yet you can't handle telling someone else tactfully how to pipe it down. Looks like you need to take YOUR own advice and grow up or stfu already!!!
whoa!! this kebbie lebbie has gotten out of hand like 10 texas tumble weeds! I don't think i am actually involved in this one - even though i do "run the board" now ROFLMAO !!
signed - the head of the board/5 buck/self promoting/ son of a darn gun/oppressive business owning blah blah ! ;) ;)
" eggs" and " sick" - look up the word 'projection" in the psychological sense in the dictionary you need to keep on the shelf by your computer ! That will be a fun analysis of yourselves ! LOL
nycmom and lyn - some of the things those "newish" posters were saying were odd and not factual - i guess they have an agenda we will all learn about ! it takes all kinds !
Wow farrah. No offense but I always skip over your posts. They're just so darn mindless & I don't have the patience!
Go away. Don't go away mad. Just go.
I agree with growup.com. Two monikers are ruining this place & their names start with "farrah" & "loveporky." Sometimes you have to get down to someones level to get them to listen. Considering what they said, stfu was spot on!!
RBTC. Seriously. People who troll internet forums for attention are pathetic. I actually feel bad for them.
Is there an ebonics translator in the house? "You need to just start trying to let anyone &everyone here know the truth."
@loveporky the more you hate on MissMannah the more I like her. Keep it up. She is coming out on top.
my reading conprehension muscle is getting a big work-out here - hopefull karposi's tunnel is not on the way LOL
Haha!Last time I looked at this thread there were only 6 posts! This is so ridiculous!
What the heck happened here? Did all the crazies come out of the woodwork tonight?
TeamMissMannah, I appreciate the thought but I don't think it is a competition. I don't need to come out "on top." (whatever that means)
If it is that difficult for you to read a few well-constructed paragraphs, Farrah, then perhaps you SHOULD go to the library more often. Also, if you lack the patience to read more than two sentences, then perhaps you shouldn't be in childcare. (Yes, I'm being snarky, and don't really give a damn.)
RBTC, you make me vomit in my mouth every single time you post. I dislike you immensely.
To : Vomit Sucks ;0)
Is there a way you can collect your thoughts, present your thoughts in written form - in a way which involves facts,generally accepted principles/knowledge you have personally obtained - let us know - we need you here !
I hope you find a good doctor to help you with your bulimia.
I love porky pig. Most dislike Mannah. So you go ahead and start a diluuaional battle about who is better bechse apparently Mannah doesn't seem to care you root her on. Loser.
Correction- I disagree. I think we NEED Porky Pig and Farrah is ok. What was I thinking. Ignore my first post. Not sure we need Mannah or Lyn though.
Feel the love! :) haha
I'm confused...am I the loser or are the people who root me on losers? Meh, I'll just go ahead and assume you mean both!
I think it is safe to say that none of us NEED to be here but that we are all welcome to post whenever we want.
Oh hi Lyn! I think you're awesome! :)
Lol, yes, all the crazies most definitely came out. As someone else said, they must really have nothing better to do than pick fights.
"Tales and RBTC are correct. Trying to "educate" people about nanny salaries by lowering yourself to insults, veiled threats of harm to their children, sarcasm, classist comments, seemingly poor math calculations in #2, and multiple grammar/spelling errors (run on sentences, got/have, than/then, your/you're, there/their, alot/a lot, good/well, of/have, etc -- basically anything not caught by spell check) is not effective."
This comment gets my vote. I couldn't have said it better.
It's not true that the only people who will accept low wages for a position are drug users/child molesters.
I have accepted wages in the past that were way, way below the going rate because I felt compassion for the families, and I was able to do it financially. I have done so because I do remember a time of being in the same kind of position, where I had no options for paying anything close to a decent wage to attract a quality person. I couldn't even afford day care or in home caregivers, I was so poor then! To be in a position where you HAVE to work, yet child care will take up well more than half of your take home pay. It's not a fun position to be in; it's actually quite scary, to love your child and want them to be treated well, but know that you can barely afford even the lowest tier of child care cost.
That was years ago for me, as I was a very young first time mother. I made do, tho. I had family members who pitched in and helped as I completed my education and worked up to a better quality of life, people who were emotionally vested in my children. If I had very young children at this moment, I could afford a nanny or to stay home. But there was a time where paying even $75/week (20 yrs ago) to an in home caregiver was a tremendous burden. I simply couldn't afford it.
However, not everyone has family support. I can not imagine being in that kind of position, to HAVE to work and knowing you can't afford quality care.
I have a soft spot for at risk kids, and I have worked with families for ridiculous rates to be able help out, because I do love children and I was financially able to do so. To me, it's not any different than volunteering to help others.
With me, they did get quality care. Care that now I am appropriately re-imbursed for, because I am qualified and give wonderful care.
I will agree, tho, that offering such a low rate will attract mostly unqualified and shady people. It's not a gamble that I personally would take, tho. My kids are way too important. But every now and then there is a legitimate person out there with a soft spot who is willing to help a struggling family.
You're right, Ohio, not everyone who accepts a low rate is shady. But more often than not, they are. Or else they have no idea how much they SHOULD be making and thus need to be educated.
A couple of years ago, I met a lovely family who had newborn twins. They were very premature and naturally the parents didn't want to put them in daycare to be exposed to so many germs. But they couldn't afford very much. So I discussed with my husband our finances and decided we could afford for me to work for very little and I accepted the job. Right before I was due to start working, the dad's mother decided to retire so she could watch the twins for free. I was thrilled for this family and not at all angry that they cancelled at the last minute. To sum up, yes some of us are compassionate.
However, I take issue with you saying some people simply cannot afford daycare. I think it is more like some people don't want to look for help. This is why we have state DHS agencies, to help out when we need it. I know in Oklahoma, if you are low-income, they will cover your daycare costs 100%. And if you're lucky enough to be Native American, you don't even have to be low-income to qualify for daycare assistance.
*However, I take issue with you saying some people simply cannot afford daycare. I think it is more like some people don't want to look for help. This is why we have state DHS agencies, to help out when we need it. I know in Oklahoma, if you are low-income, they will cover your daycare costs 100%. And if you're lucky enough to be Native American, you don't even have to be low-income to qualify for daycare assistance.*
Miss Mannah,
I agree with you to a degree. In my case 20 years ago, I was not aware that such a thing existed, seriously! I didn't grow up in the welfare system, so beyond applying for a medical card for my son during the time that we had no insurance, I didn't know there was childcare help and no one ever told me there was!
I have also known families who were just barely above the income threshold to receive such help. Daycare costs in this area are not covered 100% thru DCF if you qualify for the help. They will cover up to a certain amount, and the rest comes out of your pocket unless the provider agrees to waive the rest, which most don't and they are not required to do. That helps, tho....it usually equals about 75-80% of daycare cost.
But yes, there are many, many families who are just above that limit and can't get help, and still be crippled by the cost of care.
Good on you that you were willing to help a burdened family.
And yes, I do agree with you that most who apply for the lower wage jobs are shady people. Like I said, it's certainly not a risk I would ever take as a parent! ~shudder~
Ohio, thank you for elaborating. I suppose 20 years ago it was a little more difficult to find out information before the internet.
It also sounds like Ohio's assistance program isn't as well-developed as ours. I apologise for making the assumption that people in all states can get their daycare paid for.
Only ignorant people use obscenities on a blog.
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