I'm having a hard time with something... my current employers are planning on having another baby. They only have one right now... a 1 year old. They are not planning on paying me more once they have baby #2. I love this job, this family, and I get many, many benefits but I think it is only fair of me to expect a raise for taking care of one more child. I really don't want to leave and they always talk about how they don't want to lose me... but how do I tell them that in order for me to stay, I need more money!
37 comments:
I would be direct. My rate for two children is__. That is how I would approach it. It's absolutely expected that you are paid more for more kids. Two under two especially.
You need to have a sit-down with these parents, away from the job.
Pointedly ask what their plans are (i.e. maternity leave, etc.) when #2 arrives. If they indicate that they assumed you would continue working for them, be ready to tell them what YOU expect.
Prepare your side of the conversation ahead of time; use a number slightly higher than what you actually want, because they may attmept to negotiate, and then you have a little wiggle room to come down while remaining at a fair price. But you have to know what that price will be beforehand, and DO NOT agree to anything lower!
Be calm, be professional, but also be frank/blunt, so that there is no misunderstanding. They may try tactics intended to guilt or maniuplate you; don't get sucked in. It's a job, it's a job, it's a job.
And if they refuse to raise your salary, then give notice. Two for the price of one is ridiculous.
I cannot believe they want to pay you the same amount for caring for an extra child....and a baby no less!!
A newborn infant will be a ton of work, i.e., multiple feedings, diaper changes, excessive crying, etc. Have you ever heard the expression, "One child is one child...two children is ten children...?" Your workload will be much extensive.
Have they already told you they will not pay you more for the extra child? If so, I would quit on them because that is the most craziest thing I ever heard.
If you want to stay, let them know that while you do not want to lose them as well, you would HAVE to earn more since you would be caring for an extra child. It's just common sense.
If they balk or refuse to pay you extra, I would give them my notice.
It's good that you are nipping this in the bud now before the new baby arrives.
Best of luck to you OP.
I don't see why they would refuse to increase your salary.
Do you already make a pretty high rate? If you get paid say like $20/hr for the one, I can see them not adding more for the baby.
It's also possible they don't see how much an extra child is since baby #2 isn't on the scene yet.
I think you should not only raise your rate for two children, you should charge a premium for several months as a newborn nanny.
Just address it as this is how much I charge. Don't ask them, tell them. And look for another job while you are at it. It never hurts to have insurance. If you aren't willing to walk, you don't really have any leverage.
Good luck, and kudos for standing up for yourself.
You sound extremely greedy.
I hope you get your raise or a job willing to pay you your 6 figures.
I mean the kid isn't even here and you're already seeing dollar signs.
I wouldn't be surprised if they want you to leave.
How long have you been with this family? Did you care for baby # 1 from the start? Is mom pregnant now?
Could it be that by the time baby #2 comes along they plan on having baby #1 in fulltime daycare?
It's pretty standard to have a raise when caring for more kids. Do some research in your area on the going rates for two kids specifically infants & toddlers. This way you can determine what a fair increase would be.
I think the range is $15-$20/hr depending on where you live.
I wouldn't charge a newborn premium.
also are you up for caring for two kids one being a newborn? Simething to think about carefully.
Eek the Devil really is the Devil!!
That was mean what you said.
OP here.
@The Devil-thanks for your input but you have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not "seeing dollar signs" as you put it--I just know they are not planning on giving me a raise and something about that seemed strange to me. Read all the posts before yours. I am not alone in thinking it isn't okay.
@Susannah-I have been with the family for a year. I have cared for the current baby since the day he was born. Mom is pregnant now-I should have specified that, sorry! The plan is for me to care for both children together once the second baby comes.
Oh and also, @The Devil--you would be surprised at how badly they DON'T want me to leave. I am extremely close with this family. Go troll some other blog.
So you've had a serious professional chat with them and they have flat out said they will not give you a raise? Weird.
Or is it you asked for a price and they said no? Since they are so generous I'm not understanding this. Could it be the price you are asking for be too high?
I'm not saying you shouldn't get a raise . I think you should.
But I think it might serve you to negotiate something that works for both parties.
It's great you feel close to this family, but don't forget that being a nanny is a job first & formost. They will have no problem remembering that when you no
longer serve their needs.
I sincerely hope everything works out for you.
OP, how do you know you will not get a raise once the new baby comes?
Do you mind telling us exactly what was said in the conversation about the raise?
Could there have been a misunderstanding and they thought you wanted the raise pre-baby?
I think it's odd a family who gives generous benefits to their nanny would refuse a raise.
Only once in my career did I not receive a raise for caring for a second child, but I knew that going in & the kids were close in age like with you.
I agreed to it because
1. I was already receiving a higher than average rate. They started me off at $20/hr when I was working in a place where the going rate for two kids was $15.
2. I was only caring for the kids. I didn't have to do the children's laundry, dishes, or room care.
Every other time in my career when an additional child was added my rate increased by 1-3 dollars depending on where I started off and how many kids & their ages I was going to end up with.
I would figure out what a fair rate would be based on your area and job duties. Perhaps add a dollarore two more so you can negotiate down.
Ask for a sit down with your employers and explain your position. I would focus on the services you currently provide and the services you'll be providing when baby number 2 comes and tthe new rate being a result of that. I would not say I need more money. While it may be true employers tend to see that as you being greedy
I also wouldn't charge a premium for the newborn.
Yes there are some people who make very high rates caring for newborns, but in my experience it's because they assume total care for newborn ( nights included) AND they teach the parents various skills and techniques.
I'd also stay away from it because it opens the doors for MB & DB to start the nickling & diming procees ie when baby #1 starts off to school half days next year you could paid a lower salary those hours.
I think I've said enough.
I get $20 caring for baby twins.
From what I've seen here that is general what people suggest to ask for when caring for two or going up to two kids.
I think it would be fair for you to ask for anywher in the high teens to that depending on where you live.
I have more. I would also discuss maternity leave with them.
Will your hours remain the same?
How will you be compensated for any time off due to maternity leave?
I also wouldn't bring up how much you love them. Though they probably will bring up how much they love you.
It's a job keep the emotions out of the raise discussion.
Thank you Fiona for your detailed responses...I really do appreciate it! Let me give you all some more info...I should have taken more time to do so in my original post so I apologize.
I have been with this family for one year. I am a live-in. I get many generous benefits--car for my exclusive use, gas, car insurance, health insurance, cell phone with unlimited talk/text/internet, groceries paid for, etc. They do a lot to make sure my life here is stress free and very comfortable and I appreciate that. I have cared for Baby #1 since he was born. I get a weekly salary that is lower than I would normally charge AND lower than the going rate where I live (I get 350/week). I normally would not have taken the job for that pay IF I was living out and had many expenses, but since I do live here and have virtually NO expenses since cost of living, food, car, health insurance, etc is all covered for me, I decided to take it because it really is a great fit for both parties. We've had a great year with minimal conflict or misunderstandings.
Now-MB is pregnant with Baby #2. I did have a short, casual conversation with MB about my nanny friend who recently received a raise because of a second baby being born in her "nanny house". When I brought it up, she simply said "Were you wanting a raise when I have the baby? We talked about it and we don't think it's something we can do comfortably..the rate you started with was what we budgeted for and with the added expense of another baby it just couldn't happen. We think that what we can't offer you in salary, we make up for in the quality of life we provide for you."
She wasn't saying it in a rude manner, but being honest and I appreciated that-but am I being taken advantage of here? They do A LOT for me when it comes to benefits and they really do treat me like a part of the family but I'm just not sure what to do. Part of me wants to just let it go and continue as usual because I have nothing to complain about in the benefits department...but otherwise it really is like a 2 for one deal when it comes to the kids.
Hope that helps give you some more info. Thanks everyone!
She's got quite the deal going.
if it were me and considering you are a live in with no other expenses I would go for no less than $500 a week in your pocket.
If you were live out I would suggest higher base.
Unfortunately, for you OP, I don't see their minds changing. I could be wrong , and I hope I am.
I would prepare myself to be looking for a new job.
I sincerely hope things work out for you.
OP, if all they can afford is $350/week for childcare, then they can't afford a nanny for 2 kids. If you work the standard 50 hour week, you are LEGALLY ENTITLED to at least minimum wage, or $362.50/week at the Federal rate of $7.25/hour. Benefits do NOT change this fact.
I think your best bet is to dust off your resume and find a new job, then give notice.
Of course, that does assume that you have a car of your own, can get insurance, and have a place to live or will find a new LI job. If you don't have those resources, you need to get your finances in order before you do leave.
This family can turn to a family daycare, since that seems to be all they can afford. I would guess that $350/week wouldn't even cover a traditional daycare setting, unless your area has extremely low COL.
Good luck, and don't let the fancy benefits keep you trapped in a low paying position.
Of course you deserve a raise. Print the a few nanny surveys and show them a raise is absolutely standard.
However, if you really love the job and want to stay given the perks, consider if there is another way you can get a "raise" that is not monetary. For example, tell mom that you would be willing to work X hours less each week in lieu of extra $. Or a reduction in other duties (assuming you have household duties as many live-ins do) as you can then have an actual break during your day. Or two extra weeks vacation. Or 2 round trip flights annually by using their frequent flier miles. Or whatever you can imagine that would not cost extra, but you would value.
But no raise is unacceptable especially considering you will have two very young kids to care for.
OP: This is a tough call because the family sounds so honest and nice plus you are living in and have all those benefits.
However, I think the mother is clueless in stating that they cannot afford a raise for you...that is one of the expenses involved in having a second child. I am floored that they didn't include that in their budget when they planned for baby number two.
If you stay w/this job and take on the extra child w/no increase in pay, I promise you in the end you will end up resentful and bitter. I can already see it in your wording. The longer you keep it in, the worse it will make you feel as time goes on.
If it were me, I would make sure I had another job lined up or at least a place to stay, then give them my notice and quit.
To work for a mother who doesn't think you should get a raise for an add'l child would eventually get to me.
You sound awesome to me!! I hope everything works out for you.
Keep us posted OP!!!!
Well you are entitled to at least minimum wage.
You aren't getting that right now if you are working typical nanny hours.
This is your call, OP you can try to talk it over with them and negotiate a raise that's suitable to both of you.
Unfortunately I do not think you will get a huge increase in salary with the them.
OK, well I'm going to go against the grain here and say that since you are living rent and bills free, $350 for two kids seems very good. If you were a live-out I would absolutely tell you to lobby for a raise but since you're a live-in and making a good amount of money already and you seem to like your job, I'd say you should stay at that rate of pay.
Thank you everyone for all of your input...I really do appreciate hearing it all. Miss Mannah I appreciate your opinion too!! I argue with myself all the time that I have it pretty good here and while some nannies may make way more than I do, I think the relationship i have with my bosses and my charge are pretty rare to come by.
I will keep you all posted. Thanks again!!
I see Miss Mannah's point OP, you do have it good. However, I do not think it is very fair and ethical to give you a much heavier workload and not properly compensate you for it. I just cannot wrap my head around the logic of it.
To me it is common sense...each add'l child is add'l work for you and therefore deserves add'l compensation.
Imagine you were a cashier at Wal-Mart and your boss asked you to stay late and stock some shelves, but he wouldn't pay you any extra for it....just be thankful you had a job and blah blah blah. You would look at him like he was on crack, right????!
I can see the benefit of this situation...it's like getting to purchase your essentials (food, transportation, phone) pre-tax. If you were making a higher salary and paying for these things out of pocket, you'd also be paying higher taxes.
I really like nycmom's suggestion. Since it seems you have a good working situation otherwise, you may be able to salvage this by negotiating for something else that you value.
I did not pay more when I had new baby and would not have if asked, must less, directed to do so. Time is time and pay is generally hourly. You should not expect to be paid more just because you may be utilizing that time in a busier manner. I am a former RN and I got exactly the same pay whether the census was 1 nurse to 1 patient or 1 nurse to 10 patients. If I had asked for more pay based on census, they would have thought me crazy and if I persisted, I would have been fired.
Non-commisioned sales clerks don't get more pay on a busy day when they wait on more customers. Teachers don't get paid more when there are more students in the class. Why do nannies think they "deserve" more for taking care of another child during the same block of time? It is this type of thinking that stereotypes nannies as handmaidens and not professionals. A professional will be looking to accomplish as much as possible in her working time, not demanding additional compensation for each additional task, like it is too much to bear otherwise.
Time in a bottle, your metaphors (while they make sense) are not apt. Teachers, nurses, sales clerks, et al get the same rate of pay each day because they are doing the same job everyday. A nanny, just like in any other job, has slow days and busy days. There are days when Baby C sleeps like an angel and there are days where she is teething and screams for 8 hours straight. I certainly wouldn't dream of asking my MB for a raise or bonus for the more difficult days. (Though I wouldn't turn it down if offered!) However, if my bosses had another child, I would expect more pay for it because it is more than twice the amount of work on a daily basis. Every single day is going to be more difficult and the nanny deserves to be compensated for it.
I do not think that Time in a Bottle's metaphors make any sense. Actually I am shocked that she compares childcare to a sales clerks (not that i have anything against working in sales) Sorry, but being responsible for a safety of a human being (in this case 2 children) is not the same as dealing with more customers. Also, I am pretty sure that there is standard when it comes to - how many children per classroom/teacher and I am sure teachers know what to expect from the beginning which is not the case in OP's situation (she agreed to take care of 1 child, unless mentioned otherwise during the interview process )
It is not only about having a busier day. I am taking care of 3 school age kids and I get the same pay on lazy and busy days but I am charging much higher then I would charge for 1 kid. Also, I would bring into discussion every extra work that is not mentioned in my contract/during the hiring process.
A professional is someone who delivers a high level of service. Lets say.. working in an office. Would you do everyone's work? For example you are done with 'your' work earlier, so would you accept additional tasks every time you have some extra time? According to what you say in order for OP to be a ''professional' she should accept with no extra cost to take care of extra child and do extra tasks and have extra responsibilities (even though during the hiring process she agreed for something else)
I wouldnt ever want to work for a person like Time in a Bottle.
Op, you do deserve a raise but you already know you wont be getting more then $350/week. If you really like your job and given perks ask for a non monetary raise (you mentioned that your MB said that she would make it up for in the quality of life for you) if not then look for another position but make sure you have your finances in order before you make a move.
So what happens when they decide to have a third child?
Their budget will be ven tighter willyou be expected to care for all 3 for less than minimum wage?
No it hasn't actually occured but you get might point.
While it's a nice suggestion I doubt they'd be willing to let you work less hours during the week or give you more benefits.
This is a sweet deal for them, you're already a live in which is less expense for them, 40 plus hours of childcare a week for two babies, and most likely chores.
In fact I'd be prepared for having some of your benefits dropped once baby arrives.
You are entitled to make atleast $7.25/hr maybe more depending on the state you live in. That is the law.
You may even be eligible for overtime depending on your state. Again not a nanny being greedy, but the law.
I caution you to be very careful about getting too comfortable with this family. It seems nice and perfect now, but they have you exactly where the want you.
Feeling guilty for wanting them to follow the law.
And feeling guilty for a logical raise.
Always, Always, take care of yourself first. It's not selfish or greedy. It's wise.
Don't become the posts we constantly see here that always start with
They seemd so nice & I loved them, but end horribly and the OP missed at least 10 red flags along the way.
@Time in a Bottle...all I can do it shake my head. You missed the whole point of my post. I am not an RN...my pay doesn't work that way. As a nanny, you generally get a higher rate the more children you care for. It's just usually how it goes. I don't feel "entitled" or greedy nor am I demanding a raise. I signed a contract agreeing to this salary for ONE baby. Soon I will not only be caring for him full time, but also a newborn baby. I don't think that it is unfair or unreasonable that I even thought about asking for a raise. Also, all of the jobs you used as examples make no sense in comparison to being a nanny. I have a teaching degree. I taught before nannying. While I think teachers should be paid way more for what they do, you know you will be in a classroom with 13+ students daily. That's what you're agreeing to. I agreed to one child, now they are adding another. If you work more hours, you get compensated for it right? Same idea.
you need to tell them that you have a higher rate for 2 children, especially if they are both possibly going to be in diapers at the same time. And caring for new born is no picnic.
perhaps you should write up a new contract or if you don't have one make one now. Tell them you want to re-phrase the contract because of the addition of the second child. Also in this contract you will outline your job role, your, pay and benefits.
They need to pay you more
Time in a bottle...so are you saying a Nanny should make $12/Hr whether she is watching 1 child or 10 children????
I won't even try to reason with you on this since I can see your logic is warped already.
Sheesh.
Wow. Time in a bottle, I am so glad I am not your nanny. A raise for a new baby is standard. Nurses, sales clerks, and even teachers do not get paid more because they are providing a very different service. A nanny is helping raise YOUR children. Do you see the distinction?
OP - when my MB had another baby I was/am paid $2 more per hour. I am not a live in though. I did like nycmom's suggestion that if they can't offer a raise maybe hours can be changed up in lieu.
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