Friday

Potty Training Sans Consistency....

Received Friday, June 6, 2008 - Perspective & Opinion
Let me say first off that I love the family that I nanny for. They are extremely nice and treat me like a person and not like a servant or the hired help. I couldn’t ask for a better family to work for. I have a situation that I don’t know how to handle and I would like some input.

Right around his birthday the mother and I talked about potty training; I told her from the very beginning that I would do whatever she liked when it came to potty training. If she wanted to wait until her son was older we could do that, or we could stick with potty training and using diapers or pull ups or underwear. I told her I preferred picking a day and starting in underwear because although it was messy it usually had better results than pull ups or sticking with diapers. Again I told her I would do whatever she wanted to do, I was flexible because I’ve had years experience in daycare and some parents have their own ways of potty training. She agreed with the underwear and picking a day. I explained to her that it’s much easier for a child if we both stick with the same method of potty training and again asked her if she was sure she wanted to go with underwear. Again I got an enthusiastic YES! We picked a date soon after his 2nd birthday and as the day got closer the mother informed me that over the course of the next month they would be traveling extensively and she didn’t think she could handle messy clothes and stopping everything to rush to the bathroom. I of course agreed with her, nasty clothes while you are on vacation isn’t much fun especially on an airplane. So I suggested we wait until they were done with their traveling before starting underwear. She agreed and so we picked another date. That day comes and we start with underwear. Of course there are accidents but we get through them and he caught on quickly and is for the most part potty trained. Fast forward 3 months. We are still working on holding it and we still have to rush to the bathroom when I hear “I have to go potty!” but we are doing great, for the most part there are no accidents, but of course nap and bedtime still requires a pull-up.

The problem lies with what happens when I’m not there. He wears a pull-up anytime I am not with him. They tell me it’s much easier when they are running errands for him to be in a pull-up so that there are no accidents and they don’t have to stop what they are doing to rush him to the potty, they have also told me that if they are busy doing something and he asks to go they tell him to wait which usually ends up with a wet pull-up. When he’s only in a pull-up over the weekend we can still get back into our routine on Monday and there are usually no accidents. Well because of the Memorial holiday I didn’t work, so they had him for 3 days. We still haven’t ‘recuperated’ from those 3 days. We have several accidents a day now, even several times in my car. Now this month I only work 3 days a week because they are taking several mini vacations. I am worried about what this month has in store for us. I of course am frustrated by the whole situation and I don’t know what to do. I don’t want to backtrack and stop letting him wear underwear but at the same time we can’t be flip flopping back and forth between pull-ups and underwear, it’s obviously confusing him. He wants to wear underwear and not pull-ups, and in fact his mom has told me she has to fight with him to get him to wear pull-ups. I don’t mind accidents, I know they are part of the potty training process but when you have a child that went an entire month with no accidents to having several accidents a day it’s makes the situation that much harder to understand. The mother made a comment in passing about him having multiple accidents and how unusual that was, I didn’t answer because I didn’t know what to say to that.

We are never at the house so while I understand it is much harder to potty train a child when you can’t sit at home their son is proof that it can be done. Many many many times I hear “I have to go potty!” while I’m driving and we stop and the very next place possible to let him go (unfortunately it’s usually a nasty gas station restroom). We can be in a restaurant sitting down for lunch and I hear “I have to go potty!” and we stop eating and rush to the potty. We can be at the zoo or the library or the store or the museum or the park or anywhere and the moment I hear those 5 words we stop immediately and rush to the bathroom. So again while I know it’s much harder to potty train a child ‘out in public’ I know their son is up for the challenge, so how do I get them to see that?

85 comments:

LindaLou said...

potty training is a developmental step like walking or talking. you and mom shouldn't be *picking a date.* you should be relying upon the child to show you when he's ready. if he's still having tons of accidents and is not reliable after 3 months, he's not ready to be potty trained. children who are truly ready, train in a few weeks and are reliable. they're also very proud of THEIR acoomplishment. why spend a year *potty training* this child when you could just wait six months to a year and the process would be instantaneous? i don't blame to mom for putting the child in a pull-up. it's insane to clean up multiple accidents.

Anonymous said...

Pull ups are great if you are at home all day and have instant access to the potty. If the child is being given two different directions like this chlid it is hard on them. You need to wait for a while before traing this little guy. After all the vacations are over and when the parents are willing to take the training responsibily. The parents sound like they do not want to be inconvienced so I would really wait a while.

Anonymous said...

We are in the process of potty training my three year old daughter. I have been guilty of putting a pull-up on her at times as well. She also asks for a diaper when she has to "poopy".


I have one great potty aide. My father was recently hospitalized. I took a few of those blue plastic lining sheets from the hospital, they look like the pads you use for puppies (you can get them at medical supply stores). I put those under her when we are in the car. She has had one accident in the car seat and I was realieved the pad was under her (the pad has an absorbent side). I also bring a full change of clothes down to shoes and sox. I learned the hard way about soggy shoes.


I try to be consistent and so does my nanny, but it is not always possible. My daughter has started having accidents after a few months of being able to hold it. I was told some times a child might regress with the potty training.


My daughter is three and still not fully potty trained. She will do it in her own time. My thoughts are forcing the issue will make the child push harder not to potty train.


Just remember, he will not be wearing a pull-up pant when he graduates from high school. Some children just need more time.

-J

Anonymous said...

We are lazy as a society when it comes to potty training. 30 yrs ago kids were potty trained by a year and a half..2 at the very latest!!(and mommies were looked down upon if they reache that point!)

mommies had insentive then:
cloth diapers and no wipes
changing a poopy diaper was a pain as the diaper had to be rinsed in the toilet and then washed.

the generation raising children today is an instant gratification generation..we are lazy and do not want to be bothered.

today we have disposable diapers and wipes and it is no big deal for a 3 or 4 yr old to still be in diapers.Frankly that is appalling to me!

As far as the advice lindalou gave..well that is just lazy.

Potty training is not developmental step, it is not at all like walking..it is a fact a child can be "trained" to use a toilet..walking and talking are not "trainable milestones" lindalou was correct, those are developmental.
For all of the mommies who are going to attack me(you know, those whose children at 3 are still pooping in their diapers)..pls..ask any mommy over 50 about potty training..they will tell you that 30 yrs ago it was VERY uncommon to see a child over 2 who was not potty trained!
all ten of my brothers and sisters were potty trained by a year and a half and we were all average kids!
My son ,now 16, was potty trained at 2 and my daughter,now23 months trained except for the nights which we should have down by the time her birthday arrives in a few weeks.
lazy parents or parents with the wrong priorities = 2 yr olds not potty trained!! Plain and simple
(of course there are medical reasons that some are not trained)

UmassSlytherin said...

I like pull-ups, personally. But I wish they made Draco Malfoy ones. Hell, I'd wear one if they did.

Anonymous said...

anon J..no no pullup when he graduates just when he starts pre school...pooor kid!

Anonymous said...

You do your job and potty train the boy the best you can remembering he isn't going to go to college with a diaper slapped on his "hynie"

Sydney said...

I understand the OP's frustration. The parents are not backing her up and reversing the hard work she is doing. As a Nanny, I have been there before and it is VERY frustrating! Hang in there OP - try to talk things out with the parents...maybe they can support the situation a little better?

Anonymous said...

Sorry you are going through this - I empathize with your frustration!

When I was going through my custody battle, my son would be with me for four days or so, then with his father for four...but a lot of times his father would pawn him off on the grandparents! So here (I started training him at 2), he'd be fine. He'd go to his father's and he'd half-heartedly train him. The grandparents didn't want to "deal with accidents" so they just kept him in a diaper. It wasn't until he was 4 and I got full custody, that he was fully trained - and that was within weeks of being with me full-time. (These are people who still had him sleeping in a crib at age 3.5.)

Some people are just plain lazy and don't want to take the time to train...especially these parents who seem to be jetting off somewhere every other week. Just keep up with the training while the child is with you. Eventually it'll all work out.

LindaLou said...

7:38 2 year olds are rarely trained, ime. they just have the adults in their life trained to hover about them as if going to the bathroom is the most important part of life. i do know what it's like to be around a young 2 who is *potty trained.* the constant reminders, being peed upon during reading time, having to undress, wipe, and wash the child. no thanks. if that's LAZY, sign me up! they're not truly trained until they can go on their own, without reminders or announcements, undress themselves, wipe, wash, and redress without my involvement. potty training is not a competetion and early trainers are not superior to late trainers. you people who brag about how early their kids potty trained are actually quite weird. who the hell cares about your kid's amazing bladder control? they do it when they're ready. end of story.

Sue Doe-Nim said...

That sounds very young.

Any thoughts of waiting until the child is interested?

Also, if he's the baby mom and dad might want to keep him little.

NVMom said...

lindalou you are right on. Hope that previous poster never has any special needs kids, wow. BTW, mine were trained at 3 and 31/2. After trying for a short time when they were younger it was obvious they weren't ready. Waiting pays off! It only took a few days to a week, with absolutely no anxieties about accidents, making it in time,etc.

Kids do not need to be put through the ringer to move through their developmental stages. Does it matter in your life now at what age you walked, were potty-trained, read your first book? Come on!

OP Here said...

OP here.

First of all he loves to say YEAH I WENT POTTY!...so he is proud of his accomplishments. And he does tell me when he has to go and can get his pants on and off on his own (it may not be perfect but he can get them on and off himself) In fact he can get his entire outfit on including shoes and socks.

Up until Memorial weekend I didn't have to remind him to go potty. He went on his own. NOW after he's been with his parents an extra day does he have the accidents.

I really do not want to put him back in pull-ups since he's been in underwear for 3 months, especially since he fights having to wear them.

We also didn't spend a year potty training. By the second week he was for the most part potty trained and he went an entire month with no accidents, to me that means he's ready.

NannyHere said...

It sounds like he's ready! I think you have an excellent idea, probably the best idea of what he is capable of, more than any of us. Because you know he can do it and he is ready, I understand why you're frustrated.

That being said, we as nannies always have to balance what we feel is right and what the parents feel is right. Since they aren't willing to try very hard, potty training must not be a priortity to them. It's just like discipline, or diet or anything else. You can't force the parents to change and if you try it's just an uphill battle.

Overall, I would say you should continue to practice pottytraining but don't worry if he gets completely trained right now. Just let it happen at the pace that is comfortable for the whole family. Sorry but I think that's going to work out the best for everyone.

Anonymous said...

Calif nanny...OP you have written my story exactly...I had my 3 yr old potty trained in a day, using underwear except at night and naps. (I dont like pull ups they are basically a more expensive diaper) But..he was only potty trained for me. The parents kept him in pullups cause they hated accidents. Too much bother. I finally told the mother that we should go back to diapers if THEY arent ready for the responsiblity of it. She quickly changed her thinking once she realized I was going to jump ship. They got more into it and everything was fine, but he would have been potty trained in a few days they dragged it out 3 months. My own son was trained at 2 ( I am 50 ). I was also a SAHM so he was my priority.

cali mom said...

Lindalou, you are right on! 7:38 sounds like she has control issues, (needing to assert her iron hand of authority on every aspect of other people's lives) and the whole point of potty training is to gve the control of it to the kid, so THEY can LEARN to control it. I agree, there's no point "potty training" for a year with a child who is just not ready, instead of continuing the diapers until they are CLEARLY ready, and having them master it in a couple of weeks. I don't know what 7:38's domestic situation is, but nowadays most people do NOT have to swish a poopy cloth diaper around in the toilet and then boil it, so whatever our grandmothers did is irrelevant here. Dentists used to "treat" cavities by pouring whiskey down a patient's throat and smashing out the bad tooth with a hammer, but nowadays we have the resources which allow us to approach the problem differently, so we do. Are we lazy, or just smart enough to accomplish a task without excessive struggle?

OP, this would drive me bonkers, and it's obvious that the CHILD is absolutely ready, while the parents are nowhere NEAR being able to master the process. Either they stop waffling around and giving themselves and the boy the easy way out, or all of you will be having accidents and dealing with neverending potty messes for the next year or more. Explain this to the mom, and see if she would rather have a couple weeks of inconvenient cleanups, or a year's worth.

Anonymous said...

anon 738 here, well after dinner with my husband and kids and a fun evening, I came back to see how many attacks were waiting for me.

Sure enough..you ladies are soo predictable..

I am not surprised at all by lindalou or calimoms responses...

CM..I am not sure why you had such exessive trouble potty training your child..perhaps if your priorities were straight and you spent less time at the computer, and more time focussed on helping your child learn to pee in a toilet it would not have been so much trouble for you..

...a little over 2 months is all it should take to toilet train a child..perhaps it is you ,lazy women, who are not ready..to blame the delay on your childis ridiculous!!

and yes, lindalou..you are lazy..your poor kids deserve more than that"having to undress,wipe and wash a child, no thanks"!!!!
But your posts speak for themselves and I would never expect your children to be potty trained until "you are ready"

yes, ladies it is such a bother..I mean God forbid you should get peed on or be inconvenienced while out..or omg have to change your childs clothes more than once a day...lazy,lazy,lazy mommies

and for the post regarding special needs...I clearly stated, that I understand some children have medical conditions that might prevent them from potty training..so that was just a cheap shot for your weak ass case..if your child is 3 and not potty trained YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED!!!!!

cali mom said...

Wow, you must have had a few too many cocktails with that "dinner" honey, because you sound schnockered. And confused. Where did you think you saw something about me having excessive trouble potty training with my child? It's been about 2 weeks and he's pretty much got it down. Even the poops. Because I didn't try to force my own potty issues onto him when he was barely 18 months.

UmassSlytherin said...

7:38,
I think the reason you are feeling attacked is that you are taking on a very controversial view of potty training and one that any person who has studied child development would disagree with. To me, what I got out of cali mom's and LL's posts is that you go with the child, not the other way around. This is in fact correct.

Of course your kids are your kids and you can raise them however you want to. But it is proper to wait until a child shows signes of potty readiness, and it is really hurtful (you may not see these hurtful results until later years) to force it on them, or make them feel as if they are under pressure to get trained. Of course you can train a child, but a child is a person and some need to be trained differently.

I used to work for a chain daycare, top of the line facility, world famous. Loved it, because all of us teachers had degrees and were skilled in child development and open to teaching kids in the manner that best suited them. I remember there were children who just happened to train later. Preschool would often be changing diapers or pullups. Kids were happy, smart, productive, organized, as was the staff, and parents were always pleased. It was a great learning and loving environment. No time limit on potty training.

It is a developmental process, in my opinion, and if you took an early childhood ed class you would learn the same thing.
And you seem to be attacking: calling people lazy because of their choices as parents is silly, especially since in my humble opinion, they are correct. They have no reason to be ashamed, no matter when their child is potty trained. To tell a mother that she should be ashamed if her child is not trained by 3 is extremely ignorant.

I am certain that your own kids will have their own issues as time goes by, regardless of if they are potty trained early.
my2cents.

Anonymous said...

Umass - I am just curious what issues a child will develop for being forced to potty train before they are ready. I ask because I am 7 years older than my brother and he had a hell of a time potty training. It turns out he had a medical condition where he had intestinal blockages and poop leaking out unknown to him. But, it took about 5 doctors to figure this out. In the years before hand (yes years) he had seen doctor after doctor that tried rewards, punishments, THERAPY etc. So there was definitly frustration and force on my parents part to get him trained before kindergarden. Yes, kindergarden. Once he was diagnosed he took a year off and started kindergarden at 6 to avoid embarassment (and lots of absenses for doctors appointments). He just graduated high school at the top of his class but I am curious what kind of damage my family could have done trying to force him to do something that was out of his control (and the doctors swore he could control).

Anonymous said...

I agree completely with 7:38. Being over 3 and not potty trained (medical conditions aside) is bit odd to me. I started potty training my daughter when she was close to turning 2. It did take a few months to get her going on a regular basis, but it was well worth it. She wasn't stressed about the potty training, I was. Its hard on the parent to potty train, not the kids. They are just learning something new. Just like showing her how to feed herself and not eat with her fingers. Potty training is hard work, but it is something that can be taught to a 2 yr old if the person doing the teaching is committed.

The OP has every right to be frustrated if this is something her and the mom discussed before hand. The mom and dad in this case are being very lazy and just hoping they will come home one day and all the work will be done for them.

Hellcat said...

7:38 PM,
I agree with you. I, and 3 of my siblings were potty trained by a year and a half.
Before I had my own son, I thought my one friend was the worst mother on the planet when I found out her 2 year old haven't even begun potty training.
I just know karma will bite me yet again and my kid will be in diapers until he is 10.

st. joseph's said...

Some of you that enter into the "Potty Training Contest" with other parents to see who's kid is the youngest to be out of diapers is ridiculous!
I'm not going to say forcing a child who isn't ready is going to psychologically damage them, but it very well may hurt their self-esteem, because some parents do get upset if the child has an accident.
When a child is ready, it should take WEEKS, not MONTHS to train them. Notwithstanding a medical condition.

mom said...

st. josephs,
I agree 100%! And my kids trained almst overnight...because they told me when they were ready...which meant that they already knew what they were trying to achieve and they were ready to wanted to do it. So easy. The boys were around three when this happened and my daughter a bit younger.
And yeah, my very zealous potty training contest neighbors looked at me funny for not even caring that my kids weren't "in the race" with theirs.
Big deal. it made no difference in the end...except my carpet had a lot less pee in it than theirs.

LindaLou said...

7:38/1:46

attacks? in post where i called MYSELF lazy? pfffffffffffttttt. hilarious.

marypoppin'pills said...

When my son was 2 we started to potty train. He seemed to be doing well. We rewarded with stickers, had a chart and everything.
Then after a few weeks, he reverted. But I'm almost sure this was because of other problems going on in his life, poor guy.
I left him alone for a little while, realizing he was under too much stress.
When he was 3, I started to potty train him again, this time alone. Within 2 weeks, he was going all by himself, washing hands, everything! I was so proud of him, and he's never had an accident!

Sometimes we have to remember that not only a medical condition could be interfering ... other stresses could be involved.

Anonymous said...

Lindalou,
I don't know if anyone else has said it on this thread, but your posts here have been really good. Thank you for everything you've written. I think you did a great job the way you trained your kids.

mpp said...

lol, mom! > carpet.

I know. I never got involved with the toilet training competition, either. But I will admit I've seen a few Parents (that I knew) that had their 4 y.o. running around in sagging diapers because they were too lazy to be bothered with it, or just didn't care.
Now that's really sad!

Marissa M. said...

Good for you for trying your hardest and caring enough to be consistent. I don't understand how a parent or anyone for that matter could want to do something positive for their child but not when it inconveniences their "busy" schedule". I too have potty trained several kids and only the last mom was pathetic( she was too busy with a full time nany who worked 70h a week and she was stay at home) .Truly It went on for like 2 years of pull ups and pooping in his pants almost at 5 yrs!!!!

It was just not "convenient" for them.

The way i feel it is either you do it or you don't. No pull ups- period. Just diaper and underwear. Carry a portable potty with you in the car if needed. Run to a dirty gas station if you need to. Just be god damn consistent.

Anonymous said...

Not that I'm holier than thou, I cuss with the best of them, but that one is unacceptable, marissa, ok?

Marissa M. said...

i don't want to hear it.

Anonymous said...

6:05 - Are you seriously policing people's use of "god damn"? For the love. There are a lot of unacceptable things in the world, a lot of which we see featured here on the regular - I mean, just look at some of the more pressing stories/articles. I think a little god and a little damn doesn't exactly qualify.

UmassSlytherin said...

crap I have to go to god damned church tomorrow.

Marissa M. said...

:) thanks anonymous, i too agree there a more important things to be "upset" about. like children being abused or woman being abused by their husbands.

cali mom said...

So, 1:34, what was the benefit of spending "several months' cleaning up messes and getting your daughter to go and use the toilet whenever she felt she needed to, instead of several weeks or several days?

LindaLou said...

5:27, thanks a bunch. all three of mine trained at 3. the youngest, just recently. it was so easy and i wasn't all that involved because he was ready. it was HIS thing and he's very proud.

marissa, i'm no prude. i adore swearing (when the kids aren't around.) i think 7:38/1:46 is a lousy, self righteous asshat and i enjoyed everyone glorying in the term *fuckery* on the other thread. that being said, many people, myself included, think you should leave the G-d out of your damn. i'm just saying. when you say that, you pretty much ought to expect that someone is bound to be offended.

Anonymous said...

I am a nanny. My own sons potty trained at 2 and 3 1/2. They were ready at very different times and they decided when they are ready. The little girls I care for are a year apart- 2 and 3. When the 3-year-old potty trained recently, her little sister also wanted to sit on the potty. The 2-year-old goes if I put her on routinely but she will not let me know if she has to go yet. We just started trying underwear and she is just beginning to make the connection. She is 28 months. She will only go on the potty for me, not for her parents. But one of these days she will be ready to do the whole thing. If she resists, I don't push it. I think you can have the potty available but you can't make a child use it, just as you can't make them eat or any other natural process.

Marissa M. said...

is *fuckery* even a word? how funny, i don't think i've ever heard that. :)

you know what offends me, people that smoke in my company or around children or just smoke period. i want to run them over with a car, i swear.

but then i think, no, 10 more years of that and you'll likely be having a limb amputated because you wouldn't stop smoking when the dr told you to stop or he's going to have to cut off your leg. and i'll go on fantastic holidays and send my kids to a good school- at your expense because your idiotic behavior is making me wealthier by the day.

i know, i'm terrible aren't I. i wouldn't wish that on a person with common sense but smile at ignorant smokers who chose to make other people have to breath in their stench.

i'll be burning in hell for sure now :) slap on the sunscreen i say.

cali mom said...

Do you own a tobacco company Marissa? Or are you a doctor? How are smokers making you wealthier?

Marissa M. said...

my husband is a surgeon (resident). he hates smokers more than i do. maybe i've been with him for too long. his humor is starting to rub off on me

cali mom said...

Thanks, I get it now. Except the part about having to amputate limbs due to smoking?

Anonymous said...

I don't know if I agree that "two year olds are never trained." I'm 23 years old, and was so well trained by the age of 2, that I could sleep through the night without even having an accident. I may be one of the only few that can say, to this point in my life, I've never wet the bed and hope I never do. ;) My two older sisters, were also trained by the age of 2 (again, could even sleep through the night without an accident, and would get up to "potty" if it was necessary.) I also have 3 nephews and one niece who were all trained by the age of 2, and when I say trained, I mean completely potty trained. It can be done, and IS done every day all over the world.

mpp said...

I don't have a little girl, so I don't know if this is true or not, but I hear that they actually potty train earlier than boys.

Could someone with a daughter enlighten me, I'm just curious.

mom said...

mpp,
Yes, girls generally train earlier.

I have several theories as to why, none of which are based on anything scientific, so I'll spare you.

I'll bet somebody here knows why for real. Maybe Marissa or her husband?

LindaLou said...

my daughter was essentially the same age as my sons, but i have also heard that girls train earlier. my daughter was a really difficult toddler though, so i'm sure i had other priorities (like both of us living through each day. heh.)

marissa, i don't hate individual smokers, but i do hate the strench smokers leave behind. it's such an ugly habit, and i certainly won't allow it around my kids.

mpp said...

I can't imagine anyone being cruel enough to smoke around their kids. I don't care what other people do to their bodies, but these kids aren't given a choice when a Parent or caregiver decides to be that selfish.

mpp said...

Oh, and thank you Mom and Lindalou.
BTW Lindalou, I've really enjoyed your posts lately.

mpp said...

Mom
Please! I'd love to hear your theory! I know it'll be good!

UmassSlytherin said...

girls are just smarter and better than boys.
that's why they train earlier.

:)

Marissa M. said...

Instead of explaining it I thought I would copy a part of an article for you to understand why vascular health is affected by smoking. Sadly some people still think you can only get lung cancer and yellow skin from smoking. i'm happy to know that most of you here agree that smoking around kids, or in a car with them-which was banned in california- is just selfish.

The disease, atherosclerosis, that narrows the arteries, is a progressive diesease even without smoking, but smoking so damages the arteries that the bypass of a smoker will fail, often in a very short period of time.

So, while a surgeon can re-do and re-do the bypass, there comes a time when the doctor is really not able, in good conscience, continue to repair a problem that is being actively caused by the patient, like someone who intentionally injures himself, of course he needs help, but there is a limit to how much the doctor can repair the problem without putting the responsibility back on the patient.

While smoking increases the odds the bifemoral bypass will fail, the disease may also progress to invade other vessels: the aorta, the main artery from your heart to the extremities; the carotids which nourish your brain; the vessels that nourish your penis may be narrowed and leave you impotent. Any artery can be damages and smoking is really the single most problem over which you as the patient have control.

As young as you are, I can't imagine you would want to face amputation, impotetnce, stroke or heart attack and you are really just marking time until one or more of the other vessels become involved.

Not such great news I know, but yes, if you continue to smoke, there will come a time athat at the very least, the pain that you have will only be repairable by amputation of one or both legs.

In our practice, I have seen 2 men choose smoking over their legs and I was really amazed to see them make that choice, but make it they did, after a long series of conversations with the surgeons, they both opted to have the amputations as they didi not want to or felt they could not stop smoking. I still see these 2 guys and have watched them try to adapt to a legless existance, and it ain't pretty.

Anonymous said...

I can't imagine a guy being given a choice whether to smoke or lose his legs. That sounds too outrageous.

erics mom said...

Its called addiction. If it was so easy to quit, I am sure they would in a heartbeat. Just like weight loss. How many of us have been on diets or trying to lose weight. Usually, we gain it back or have trouble keeping it off.

Lucy said...

IDK. If I had a choice between a pack of marlboros or a twinkie - and my legs, I think I'd choose my legs.

Anonymous said...

cali mom, In answer to your question..what did my children & I get for potty training at a decent age??

For me..less guilt about the 22 billion Disposable diapers and wipes that end up in land fills every year..an almost $1000.00 dollar savings in diaper costs per child and pride both in my children and in my self for making my children and their accomplishments a priority.

Just a note for you and Lindalou**********more than 50% of the worlds children are completely potty trained by age 1*this is according to "Contemporary Pediatrics Magazine"

For those of you practicing Dr Terry Brazeltons "teach when ready method",adopted by the Americam pediatrics association...you are lazy..yes, cali mom, mom ,lindalou,umass,stjosephs & mmp you are all lazy parents with the wrong priorities..our country is behind so many others when it comes to academics and developmental milestones and especially when it comes to potty training

so, thank you..to all of you who have helped to keep us on the other side of that 50%

Ridiculous!

cali mom said...

I suspect by that ridicuous 50% figure, you mean the take-away-the diapers-and-have-them-squat-in-the gutters-or-in-the-jungles method prevalent in other areas of the world. THAT is not potty training, that is just random bodily elimination witout diapers or wipes. But how puzzling it is that with all the problems of the world, your primary concern is what age other people's children learn to use the toilet by theselves. no wonder you always sound like a raving lunatic.

BTW, did you beat your children fornot learning to walk at what you considred a "decent age"?

UmassSlytherin said...

3:53,
Detention!
And 100 House Points from Hufflepuff!

But seriously, you are the one who sounds ridiculous, dear. Be rational: you don't know us, how can you begin to call us lazy because of our point of view regarding one singular issue? That is simply ignorant. 50% of the world's children? Please. I'm glad I live in America, one of the many reasons being that my child does not have to be forced to be trained by a certain age or feel shamed by it.

Put down your books and medical journals and run around with your kid, play pretend, fight dragons, color on the sidewalk, smile, love your neighbor, eat snow cones and be silly. Maybe you're too "lazy" for all those things?

Thank God we are not all like you!

LindaLou said...

lol. many of the world's children don't even have dipaers. they're carted around my their mothers in slings and when they start to potty, mom just lifts them away from her body so they can go on the ground. seriously, you are so ridicluous. yeah, forcing my children to potty on the toilet before they were ready wasn't a prioroty for me, in fact, my daughter could READ before she was toilet trained. damn right i had other priorities, and proud of it! They did in their own time and are none worse the wear. the older ones are almost 11 and almost 8, and they don't seem to be mourning the extra year they missed out on using the toilet.

and btw, if you used disposable diapers or formula AT ALL, you've contributed more to the landfill than i have. we've cloth diapered three children, plus i never used formula (how many formula cans do you think are in the landfill?)

you sound like you have such a weird chip on your shoulder. do you really enjoy being such a mean nasty bitch? i don't even get why the age other people's children potty trained or what parenting philosophies they follow would concern you in any way.

mpp said...

3:53
Did you not read my post? You definately didn't pay any attention to a word I said.

I will reiterate for you:
My son was potty trained by the time he was 2. Then due to extenuating circumstances he started to revert. He was under a tremendous amount of stress from family upheaval, and after consulting with his Pediatrician, I was advised to let him be, and I did.

When things started to calm down a little bit for him, he was almost 3, so I tried again. This time, it was quick and easy because technically he had already been trained, and he surely remembered what he had learned. In less than 2 wks., he was ready to go and has never had an accident.

Next time be careful what you say before you say it. The last thing I am is a lazy Parent! I did what was best for my child at the time, and I don't regret a single thing.

Anonymous said...

3:53 -
You are a bitch. And before you have a fit and scream "all the regulars are after me!" - just remember WHO slung the dung first!
You mentioned certain posters names, and called them lazy parents! Do you not expect them to stand up and defend themselves?

I am so sick of your pettiness. Please go crawl in a hole somewhere and die. The world would be so much better off without the likes of you stinking it up!

Anonymous said...

I feel sorry for 3:53's children. They are being raised by a Hitleresque mom. I bet you beat your children every time they had an accident, huh?
If they spilled their milk, did you make them lick it up off the floor?
If they didn't pick their toys up, did you put them in a bin in the front yard and make them watch you set them on fire?
I guarantee your kids are afraid of you, and that's no way for a child to live.
It must suck having you as a parent.

mom said...

What a ridiculous (and excessively angry...what's up with THAT!?) post at 3:53.
It sort of brings to mind two of the funniest terms I have "learned" on this site..."Angry Inbred" and "Asshat."

I really don't care when you trained oyur child, because, (as MPP correctly pointed out...you don't seem to have READ our posts at all)...I chose NOT to join the Potty Training Races when my kids were small...so why, when they are mostly grown, would I care to join them now?!

To each his own. (Only it sounds like the rest of us won't be bursting any veins in our foreheads over YOUR choice.)

lucy said...

3:53
Some nerve you've got! Why would you even care when other parents potty trained their kids? Does that make your kids faster, stronger and brighter just because they could aim it into a big piece of porcelain?
You are so ridiculous!
Thank you for my laugh for the day because I've never seen such a lame post in my life!

LindaLou said...

you guys are just JEALOUS of her! she's more patriotic while your diaper soiling kids are bringing down america's toileting stats! go U.S.A.! ;)

Anonymous said...

I gurantee that every post above responding to my 353 post has had a child 3 or older running around in a diaper at one time or another.

MMP weather you are big enough to accept ot or not, I do not not know but yes, you are right, I randomly included you in my post and I should not have.
And I am big enough to say I am sorry, so,

MMP< I am sorry.

I am also sorry your son and family had to deal with such large amounts of stress.I wish that on no one , especially children.

as for the rest of you stating I was"slinging dung first"

my first anon post (738pm)stated "we as a society are lazy when it comes to potty training"

I did not point the finger at any of you, accept to say that the Advice LL gave was lazy and in my opinion, it is.I then went on to say she was right in other areas and then on to give personal experiences just as all of you usually do and then boom..

LL says "who the hell cares how amazing your childs bladder control is?
cm states I have control issues,needing to assert my iron hand of authority on everybodies lives??? also accusses me of being drunk??

nv mom brings up special needs,"which I clearly adressed as understanding"


so, just as all of you do almost every night from what I can see, I struck back after personal attacks,although,I unlike you have not sunk as low as to refer to any of you as bitches, or raving lunatics or the likes.
Of course I expect you to defend ytourselves, but why always so foul and vile??
LL , CM and umass are some of the worst offenders.always,always calling nasty names!!

to the three of you and

to the anon posters(whom I believe to be one in the same)451&458 your posts are pure hatered and I hope that when you teach your children about dealing with people that you disagree with you, you do not teach them the way you yourself respond to those people, that would be a shame.

Anonymous said...

I would love to know how old lindalou and Lucys kids were when they were completely potty trained(if they are yet)...honor system ladies.

Come on..exact ages..3 is a whole 12 months vague....3years 6 months?? 3 years 11 months...any takers?

Anonymous said...

lindloo, you are always looking for a fight. you must have been an older sibling who always bugged all the other kids..you are good at it
so mean
so angry
always having to make sure you make the other guy look bad
low self esteem is usually behind that ya know

UmassSlytherin said...

3:53/6:49,

nasty names? when did I call you a nasty name?
wait, are you one of the people who I told to shove a mandrake plant up your arse?
my bad.
:)

Anonymous said...

hey umasslytherin, I hope your child grows up with your playfullness and humor but not your anger and mean spirit!

UmassSlytherin said...

anon @ 7:34,

I hope your child grows up with my playfulness and humor too, but not your delusional perceptions of anger and mean spiritedness that do not exist (in me, anyway.)

:)

JerseyXJacqui said...

I'm confused as to why umass keeps getting accused of being ANGRY...
Like I said in another thread, she seems to be the furthest thing from it. The opposite of angry, in fact.

Weird. Because someone disagrees with you and/or defends themselves against ridiculous accusations, they're ANGRY? She's hasn't resorted to name calling, idle threats or angry tantrums and outbursts. From what I have seen, she responds back objectively and calmly...and with conviction. Maybe the latter is what is perceived as ANGRY. And if that's the case, then I agree with you Umass...it sounds like someone is delusional.

OP Here again said...

Wow remind me never to ask for advice from you guys again.

I needed advice on how to talk to the mother. I didn't want to start nor read a fight over the age at which to potty train.

I know this child and have known him since he was 3 months old. I see him 10+ hours a day and usually overnight on the weekends too. I also have 8 years experience working with 2 year olds in daycares and I do know when a child is ready to be potty trained and when they aren't 'mine' is.


I need advice on how to talk to the mother. How to explain to the mother that she is holding her son back. I do not need advice on if he's ready to be potty trained or not.

Anonymous said...

OP,
excuse us, but you are the nanny, not the mother. You need to do what the mother wants. End of story.

op said...

The mother wants 2 things. Did you even bother to READ WHAT I WROTE?

Man you are beyond ridiculous.

Anonymous said...

careful OP..they attack anything that moves and is not like them!!

click here. lucy said...

Well jeez, sorry OP. Do you not realize that when you're on a blog you're going to get varying degrees of opinions, and that just by the nature of being driven by so many people, it will go off in 10 different directions?

Anyway, how about printing out something for the mom on how "holding him back" could injure his self-esteem? Not to mention his confidence, as he will surely notice his younger playmates running around without diapers.
Hopefully the article I've enclosed will help you.
Good luck.

Anonymous said...

lucy, how do you attach the article where you wrote click here?

Anonymous said...

That's some really good info. If the mom reads it and doesn't pick up on her child's interest in being ready to go, then there is something really wrong with her.
And from what you describe, that kid sounds ready!
Make sure you approach her carefully. Make it sound like this is something the both of you need to get on the ball and do TOGETHER!

lucy said...

10:26
Copy the URL, and then paste it where you want it to go.

(At the bottom of this box, it went into the Name/URL part where it says "optional".)

Anonymous said...

Lucy, I am not speaking for the op ,however, I think she is just as surprised at all the catti-ness on this site as I am and it always seems to revolve around the same monikers.of course with a fair share of anonymous posts as well.
She was asking for very specific advice and got to witness a major cat fight instead.

lucy said...

Well, I added my 2 cents, and I hope it helps her. I believe it was what she was asking for. If not, then I don't know what to say.
Thanks.

mpp said...

3:53
Thank you. I appreciate that.

OP said...

Thank you for the link Lucy, that's exactly what I need.

Anonymous said...

i think some of you are missing the point. The child does not sound "unreliable". But he can't actually take HIMSELF to the bathroom in public, it sounds like his parents force him to pee in his pullups by IGNORING him when he says he has to go to the bathroom.

heaven forbid they put down the cocktail to take the kid to the bathroom.

Anonymous said...

3:53
I think that's exactly why OP wanted help.

Lazy parents.

lucy said...

Op, you are most welcome!
Best of luck to you!