Received Tuesday, February 13, 2007
I live in California and for the past 2 years I have employed a live-out nanny. Previous to this, I always had live-in nannies. I mention this only because I felt that I really KNEW the live in nannies I had because our non "work" lives were also intertwined. I have two girls who are in school full time now, but this doesn't mean they are not attatched to the nanny. The nanny also knows how we like things run in our house, knows the location of playdates, the geography of the town, etc. All of this is good, I know. This weekend I found out that my nanny had been taking old clothing of my daughters and toys and reselling them at resale boutiques in Westwood.I can't say for certain what happened to the toys, only that they did not end up where they were supposed to.
This bothers me because not only did we tell her where the old things were supposed to go, (ie the toys always go to a certain shelter and the clothing to an organization that helps educate young, single mothers). That is bad enough. But looking back to conversations we had, she would lie outright about having dropped off the clothing, she even created whole scenes (that never happened). The details of this are not in question. She absolutely knew where to take these things and knew they were non profit agencies and she told me that they had been dropped off. My husband thinks I am completely overreacting and looking to make a mountain out of a molehill. (His words). I just don't trust her at all anymore. I can't stop but wonder what else she has lied to me about. And believe me the last thing I want to do is hire a new nanny but I don't think I can get past this. The nanny does not know we know about the resale boutiques. For the record, my husband thinks the solution is that we simply handle any charitable donations/drop offs ourselves.
Who is right? Who is wrong?
65 comments:
The way I see it you should confront her about the lying. be forthright about how you feel about her lying to you. I don't understand why she would lie about where she took the clothes. Its not like she could have been getting that much money when she sold them to a resale shop.
I don't agree with your husband wanting to just let this slide, she lied to you, that is not acceptable.
After you talk to her, then decide if this is something worth firing her over. best of luck....
I would make her donate the money to the charity! I am guessing that by the fact she took them to a "resale boutique" in the LA area that the clothing was high end.
Well, I would sit down and talk with nannhy, explain what you've found out and how it makes you feel, then ask her if she would like to explain what she did.
Then, you can all decide together if the trust issue is repairable or not.
If you decide to keep her on, I would also make it clear to her that she will no longer have access to items to be donated to a charity, and do that yourself.
i would worry what else she lied about???
once a liar allways a liar..thats how i feel
Definitely let her know that you are aware of the situation. Give her the opportunity to confess to anything else she may need to get off her chest. Encourage her to donate the money.
Ask your daughters how they feel about the nanny. If they are in school they are definitely old enough to "tattle-tale" on the nanny.
Only you can decide how big of an issue you feel this is and whether or not you think it is worth having to find a new nanny and get your girls adjusted to a new nanny.
If she is going to such lengths to lie to you she probably needs the money. She may not be making enough to live on comfortably. Are you paying her enough?
Also, what difference does it make to you? The stuff is gone either way, and in both cases you are helping somone out.
If it bothers you that she is lying than stop the lying. Tell her it is ok for her to take the stuff and sell it but also talk to her why she felt the need to lie to you about this. It could be that she is just to afraid to ask you if she can sell the stuff or to ask for a raise.
I would give her the opportunity to come clean. ask her why she did what she did? there may be some underlying factor why she needed the money? I dont think its the end of the world, but i think you need to be comfortable with the situation. hth
I would give her the opportunity to come clean. ask her why she did what she did? there may be some underlying factor why she needed the money? I dont think its the end of the world, but i think you need to be comfortable with the situation. hth
How is she helping someone out if the nanny is taking the stuff to sell at a resale boutique? You do realize that some nannies are very well paid. And who is the nanny to decide who gets to be helped? Maybe the mother had a comittment to those non profit agencies. The nanny no doubt made the woman look like an idiot! If you want to help someone out, you do not SELL your clothing. It is reprehensible for anyone of any class to sell their baby clothing, toys or items. There is always someone who has less than you! This post is what is wrong with America. Well, this and liberals. But, I digress.
3:31:
Nice way to try to pin this on the employer. Big eye roll there.
OP:
What she did is 100% unacceptable. I hate to say it, but I think you should fire her. I se no other alternative. If you confront her things will end up getting funky no matter how you handle it, so go for broke.
In the future, make the donations yourself. I honestly don't know why that task would be delegated to a nanny to begin with. Her job is caring for the kids, no? I don't have my nanny run personal errands.
what about mentioning needing reciepts for tax purposes? maybe ask her if she ever got reciepts when donating the items.
I understand your situation. I went through something that caused me not to trust my nanny. This just does not work. You need to be able to trust the person caring for your children. My husband acted like I too was making a big deal out of things. For the most part, you can never expect men to have the same sensibilities and compassion as women when it comes to matters of the heart and matters involving children. So go with YOUR gut. Your instinct.
You should have handled the donation drop-offs yourself from the beginning. I agree with your husband -- you're overreacting. You gave her a menial task to do and she took advantage -- oh well.
3:31 - I'm with you on this.
"It is reprehensible for anyone of any class to sell their baby clothing, toys or items."
Clearly you have never worked with those who are really in need. I have worked with families that sell teh things that their children outgrow so that they have money to buy the new things the children need. I suppose you also look down on people who buy baby things at consignment shops or yard sales. Stop being so judgmental about a whole class of people. You are showing yourself to be the reprehensible one.
i am sure there are other "menial tasks" the nanny is entrusted to. The OP says her children are in school FT. You should be able to trust someone to give you correct change, whether it's 2 cents or $9000.00
Why do you have your nanny doing menial tasks anyways? Is she your housekeeper? Is she your personal assistant? Why don't you only have her working for you part time if both your girls are in school full time? It seems to me that if donating items to charities meant that much to you, maybe you would take the time to do it yourself instead of haivng your nanny go out of her way to do it while she should be focused on your girls. I agree with your husband. If you've got a nanny that does a great job with your girls, isn't that the important thing?
I don't think this is only an issue of lying. You specified charities the things were to go to, so essentially, she stole them from these charities. You are not making a mountain out of a mole hill. I would consider this dishonest and a serious breach of trust.
A nanny
Thank you 4:54 poster! Many people sell things their children outgrow - just look on Craigslist and eBay. It doesn't make someone less of a person to buy something used. In fact, it makes a person smart in instances when it is something you child will outgrow fast!
331, you are way off base. The nanny STOLE the clothing. It wasn't like the clothes/toys were just going to a goodwill store. They were going to help specific charities. The OP should NOT let the nanny continue selling the clothes, nor should she have a job anymore.
OP, I feel really bad for the situation you are in. Other than stealing, is she a good nanny? Do you feel like you can trust her anymore? I don't agree with you husband. There are things that upset me that don't bother my husband. But I trust my instincts. Who knows what a thief would do in retaliation if confronted. Personally, my advice if you are 100% sure she resold the clothes, would be to let her go. Once the trust is gone it is hard to cross back over that bridge. And if you don't let her go, keep an eye on your belongings. Just a concerned mom.
Being a Nanny myself you should just straight out ask her. I have had employers give me clothes to do what ever I wanted with them. They told me I could either sell them in a garage sale, take them to a resale store, donate them or keep what I liked. I would do all of the above. the same went with toys too and other household items. technically if you are giving her stuff to donate to charitys, its her name on the tax reciept so you get no tax write off.
If you want the things to go to a specific place, take them your self, she is your Nanny, Not your housekeeper, she is there to watch your children. not take care of your messes.
I think what the nanny did was completely wrong, but at least give her a chance to explain. Maybe there is something going on in her life right now that she really needed the money for. If she dosen't have a damn good excuse for needing the money I'd fire her.
810, are you an ass or what?
My nanny didn't want to stop working for us when our children went to school full time. She wasn't about to do housekeeping but be damn sure she runs household errands. She makes a FT salary - 700 a week and excepting holidays and vacations, she works 20 hours a week at best! she isn't complaining so shut your mouth.
I am wondering how the mother knew that this was happening? Did someone tell her? Did the nanny tell someone and that person let the mother know? Did the kids tell the mother?
I just want to know the facts: how does the mother know that she did this. And how did she come to find out?
How is it relevant how the mother found out? Jeezus. The truth always comes out in the end! Why are you looking for a way to rationalize this? Or do you just want more dirt?
As a mom and a nanny it really does make me feel sticky to know that that happen to you. I am shaking my head as I think of it right now because a major part of the human bond between you guess has been broken. Trust is a huge issue in any relationship and especially when it come to being able to count on someone who cares for your children. Once that trust have been volilated or broken, just have a huge fork in road and it is hard to say just how to proceed forward. I am not judging this nanny or why she went to extreme measures and did what she did but it does make me pause with a lot of concern.
As a mom I have both given away and sold some my children unused clothing. We are shopaholics and they are usually new or in excellent condition. I have recently revisited the thoughts of give them away when I read on ebay a seller who stated quote" I give all of the nasty used stain clothing to charity so this that I am selling are simply the best!" I thought what the crap. I thought if they are not worth selling then they are not worth giving them away. Then I also thought is why so many of the clothing that some children in shelters wear look so worn because people only think to donate the worst of them. Then there is the other side where often when I have giving them away at charitable organizations like shelters, the worker have taken what they wanted for themselves and the clothing have end up elsewhere other where I intended for them to be. Which put me back at selling them. Recently I have decide to find residents in shelter or places in need and give them the clothing directly myself.
However, whatever I have done with them, they were in fact my own children's clothing. I could never go to work and take the clothing of my charges which were meant for charity or anyone else and sale them as my own. Take them period and then selling on top of that when they don't belong to you is called stealing. That in it self is a rather unsavory favor you would want in your child's care giver! As much as I would want to forget, it would be there with a huge question mark of what is the truth in what she is saying and the fact that there is no trust.
And it does not matter where it was your nanny job to take them their or not, if she accepted the job, she should have been honest or asked you about what her intent was to do with them.
While I feel bad for anyone who is about to lose their job, the issue of trust is one that I could not do without. I would feel cheated by the nanny in an emotional sense because this was someone that you totally thought you could trust. There certainly needs to be a discussion here and perhaps a hard lesson learned. I am sorry, big ouch but you lied about where you took my children clothing how can I trust that you have not lied about more.
There would have to be some serious hard work at mending this depending upon yours and your children's disposition towards the nanny. If you can mend this and she is worth saving then I say go for it. If not than certainly for the sake of everyone involved your nanny will need to go. You can not have any peace in your life when you are stuck with a fork called trust in the middle on the road.
I would not make any rash decisions about her before discuss it with her but in the end it is your gut feelings and those of your children that really counts. And also remember that people do make mistakes, the question is will it cost her job and only you know.
BTW
If you do let her go please explain to her what you found and why you are uncomfortable so that maybe their is a lesson learned. And if you all can end on a good note, deciding that she is remorseful but this situtation is not workable and perhaps you can give her time to find a new position and give your children a chance to adjust to the changes they are about to go throuh if they really love her and she feeling the same way about them.
You never know what can motivate someone level of greed. Bottom line talk it over.....
OMG, you are so overreacting. Who cares? The stuff is gone now. If you want something done right, then do it yourself, otherwise, don't complain.
And give the girl a darn raise. She obviously needed that extra money.
Why do you assume the nanny isn't paid enough? This making excuses for shitty behavior needs to stop. Nothing is as low as a liar.
Bu Bye!
Oh my god. You are not overreacting at all! They are YOUR possessions. She has absolutely no right to do anything with them that you don't want. Plus can you really trust someone who steals your child's clothes and sells them instead of giving them to charity? You owe it to your child to get a better nanny.
It is relevant how she found out because nobody is perfect and the mother herself may be mistaken. It would not be the first time a nanny was falsely accused of something.The mother's unwillingness to discuss it with the nanny suggests some uncertainty.
I am in no way excusing the behavior if it is indeed what happened. But let the nanny explain herself. How could a mother keep a nanny on who stole from her? It doesn't sound right to me. I too would like more facts...
you are so hungry for gossip. do not feed her.
Your husband. Anyone who seems so not in touch with what is going on in his own home is in my own opinion just doing double duty dipping his pen in the company ink.
This is appalling. The fact that she not only stole the clothing/money but also made up elaborate scenes to corroborate her story would make me VERY uncomfortable and unable to trust her in the future.
If she needed the money, she should have ASKED if it would be okay for her to sell them instead of donating them. The clothes were not hers to take.
The elaborate lies would definitely make me wonder what else she has lied about. I would confront her and ask for an explanation. If you aren't ready to fire her (and I think you are justified if you are) I would warn her that you will be on alert for any other questionable behavior.
And to all those griping that it was not her job to run this errand, I don't see what the big deal is. I'm a professional nanny who never does any cleaning or personal errands, but I routinely go through the CHILDREN'S toys and clothes and weed out the things that no longer fit or are played with. I box them up to get them out of the way and have on numerous occassions donated them to charities specified by the parents or to charities of my choosing with their blessing. I don't consider this a "menial task". I enjoy the opportunity to arrange a donation for a deserving charity. And I certainly thing that maintaining order in the children's closet/playroom is within my scope of responsibilities.
i am a nanny and i think you should definitely fire her and let her know why. she is STEALING.
If you think about it she isn't just lying to you, she is stealing from you. I would seriously consider getting rid of her. I would not be able to trust her anymore and would not want someone like that watching my children.
She is lying and stealing.
Your husband is an ass.
You should confront her and give her a chance to explain.
Then fire her.
oh yes I love how your husband thinks. Thathe sound like he is relate to mind in the male spiceen sort of way. Only you to talk to and explain to your husband in a hun dear way that this should be a big deal when trust has been violate by someone who cares for your children. There are certainly lines on a job that you never cross and elborate lying and stealing are among them. While for my own piece of mind in the future, I would handle such donations, giving her this task and having her to accept it does not excuse her behavior of lying and stealing. Confront her, explain it to her and show her the door. She sounds like a socialopath because of the lying and stealing with no remorse. She was not entitled no matter what you pay her, ask her to do etc. She did it because she felt like it was easy and took advantage of your trust. She felt entitled and she certainly was not! If you truly know what you know, talk to her, tell her to get help and show her the door!.
You are not overreacting. What she did was dishonest.
The people making ridiculous comments about the husband not making a big deal over it and wanting to let it go just make me shake my head in disbelief.
I think many women, including myself, find themselves married to men who are non-confrontational and *would* rather let it go than make a scene. Why do these threads always have to be reduced to accusations about the husband either sleeping with the nanny or wanting to? Just because he doesn't see the situation the same way as his wife doesn't make him an "ass" or bad husband.
That being said, I agree with the other people who said there could be extenuating circumstances that we and the OP know nothing about (i.e. nanny is desperate for extra funds to make ends meet). However, I think lying is really never okay and like the OP said, one will always wonder what and when the next lie will be. Will it be a lie about someone more important? The children? The OP has to figure out if she can repair the nanny/employer relationship and if not, then she needs to move on and find another nanny who is a better fit.
If the children are in school all day, I see nothing menial about or wrong with running errands for the family to fill in time so that a nanny can keep fulltime status with a family. I did it for years for a family I worked for.
I also wonder why she would feel the need to sell the clothes when she knew she was supposed to donate them. It could be that she is doing badly financially? That still doesn't make it right by any means.
As a nanny, it seems her job would be to take care of your children, not get rid of your old stuff. On that respect, the fault lies with you, as you giving her that task gave her the opportunity to do something bad. As an employer, it is part of your responsibility to ensure you do not give your employees such opportunities, ie.. ask for a form of receipt for the donation, etc. Donation places do give receipt requests you know, for tax purposes. She lied yes, but I don't see it as a reasons for firing her. Definately shouldn't be ignored however, or a level of trust can never be reestablished.
Bull crap as a nanny myself you all keep making excusing for her behavior, AND THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR LYING ABOUT AND STEALING SOMEONE ELSE CLOTHING. IF YOU ARE IN NEED YOU ASK! DOES NOT MATTER WHOSE JOB IT WAS TO TAKE THE CLOTHES WHERE SHE TOOK THE JOB SHE SHOULD HAVE TAKEN THE CLOTHING WHERE THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE. I AM A MOM AND A NANNY AND MORE I READ THIS THE MORE IT PISSES ME OFF!
I agree with 7:43. It's the employer's responsibility not to give people an opportunity to steal from them? Ridiculous! If you leave your keys in the car and a thief takes it, it's all on the thief! The three dozen other people who walked by your car didn't steal it, did they? A dishonest person will always find a way.
Fire her ass! If you knew she would do this when you first met her would you have hired her? No. Then what's the question here?
I would definitely fire her. There's no "room for error" when it comes to your kids and the people you keep around them. She has lied to your face repeatedly and you need to follow your instinct on this. And, people, do not assume her kids would "tattle" on the nanny if she were lying or doing improper things. Kids can very often feel intimidated and hesitant when it comes to telling their parents things of that nature. Don't take any chances when your kids are involved. Get rid of her.
What is with all you people excusing her behavior? I'm an attorney, and if my secretary steals money from the office account, she's going to get fired! And I'm sure you'd all support me in that decision because not only is it my money, it could be client money that she's stealing. That makes perfect sense to everyone. And frankly, it's my understanding that most nannies make way more than my secretary. But when someone embezzles from their office, no one says "Aw, cut her some slack, maybe she really needed the money." IT'S THE SAME THING, PEOPLE!
If it wasn't within the scope of her responsibilities, she should have been frank with the OP and said, "This isn't my job." So I don't buy the whole passive-aggressive "stealing as retaliation" theory, either. Give me a break. She stole, she lied about it, and you can't trust her anymore. Fire her.
Maybe the nanny had clothing from other sources that she was selling and she actually did donate your things. I'd make darned sure I had the facts absolutely bullet-proof before I'd approach her about it. Otherwise, you could end up being the one to ruin a great relationship after she finds out that you thought she was capable of stealing from you.
To make a long story short, my nanny is a single female with no dependants. She is paid $17 per hour. (We pay her taxes for her). She wants to work as many hours as she can during the week and since our girls are in school from 8-3, she has offered to run errands, etc. Our nanny is very bright and educated. I only found out about this when at a child's birthday party, I met the birthday girl's little sister who was wearing an old dress of one of my daughters. My daughter recognized it. And because my daughters are 16 months a part, I label all of their clothing with their first name. There is no question these garments were ours. There is no question that they were to be donated to charity and there is no question that she TOLD me that she had made the drop offs. I plan to speak to her on Friday and see what she has to say for herself. I think it is an awfully low thing to do. She isn't at all underpaid (for our area). Thank you to everyone who offered sensible responses! I value your input.
1:57
Is it possible that your nanny donated the clothes to the charity and the charities sold them to raise money???
I would think the charities would do that.
The charity I was always instructed to drop things off for sold them in a consignment store-anyone could have bought them, including the mother of the child at the party. Did you ask the mother where she bought them?
Also, the clothing aid boxes in our city the clothes are sold to raise money for their charity, the clothing does not go to them, the money from the clothing does.
It is possible she did as you were told, and the dress made it to some shop where the party mom bought it, and the money she paid for it went right where you wanted it to.
To the idiot at 1213 AM, stop making excuses for thieving whores.
The mother said she had a connection to these charities. She damn well knew what the charity did with the clothing. I mean COME on. You make me sick. If a nanny robbed a bank, I would guess you would piss and moan about how she only made $15 an hour.
Boring.......
As I think about this, one thing that really bothers me is that your nanny is making you look dishonest. If you have contacts at these shelters, and promise donations, how does it look if the donations never actually get there? It undermines your credibility.
While there is a chance this it may be true, assuming that this nanny needed the money is a mistake. People, rich and poor alike, are often greedy. That's all there is to it.
Your husband probably doesn't care because he is bangin' the nanny on the side. Ya know the hand who rocks the cradle and all that good stuff.
I don't believe for one minute you are paying your nanny $35.00 an hour.
How is $17 an hour $35 an hour? Idiot. And if I was making $17 an hour, I would offer to polish wood to accumulate more hours.
And in case you don't know anything about nannies and employing them, a good lot of people pay there nannies 12-15 dollars per hour CASH. Under the table. This drives up the rate for those people who want to pay their nanny legally. It isn't fair!
I will post nice and slow for ya, idiot.
She said she pays the nanny S E V E N H U N D R E D dollars for T W E N T Y hours of work- AT BEST she said.
Take 700 and divide by 20... that's $35 an hour sweetheart. Now go take your meds and lay down.
Divide 700 by 20... that's how you figure out $35 an hours.
Hey sweetie- she said that she pays her nanny $700 a week and her nanny works 20 hours "if that".
Divide 700 by 20 and you will find that will give you THIRTY FIVE dollars an hour.
Tell me again, who is the idiot? That would be YOU.
We had a nanny like this and ultimately I found out that she was lying about taking the baby to 'play' at the park. She would just leave my toddler in the stroller and then make up a big story about how she played on this and that at the park. Then I found out that she was stealing change and other cash from the house. She too was a good lyer.
I know it isn't easy to change nanny's. If I were you, I would follow her a little more closely - ie spy on her at the park and then later ask them how their trip was. See if she honest there or not. If she's not fire her fast.
It's sad but if you leave your children with strangers you will never know 100% if they were neglected or physically, verbally,emotionally, sexually, abused. I have worked in some of the best child care centers in a major city and you would be shocked at some of the minor and major things that take place every single day.
People are not robots- they sometimes lose it, have sustance abuse issues, mental health issues, etc. If you can put a child in the care of a stranger you need your head examined. Most children do not tell when they are abused.
FIRE HER.
She's stealing...not from her boss but from the poor. Since the clothes were meant for charitable organizations, they were as good as donated. Would you want to hire someone who would steal clothes from the donation bin and sell them on Ebay?
And for all you crazy people who ask why the OP would assign her nanny such a "menial" task. Um...dropping off clothing...is it really that hard? Especially since both children are in school full time so the nanny should do some work during the day to earn her keep? It's not like they have her scrubbing the toilets.
You should never have asked the nanny to drop your things off at the charities. Nannies are professionals who have chosen to care for children as a career--not haul away trash whether it is to a charity or the dump. Would you ask your child's teacher to do that?
Thay being said, as an employer of a nanny, she lied. You can't trust her. Fire her. Period.
First off, nanny responsibilities vary from family to family based on the terms of the offer of employment. Since the posting did not mention this nanny's terms of employment, it certainly would be good to just stick to the issue.
With that being said, I'm having my own issue which I just discovered tonight. My new nanny who has been employed for about seven weeks has been stealing from me. I noticed last week that a very large change jar was missing from the pantry. I searched high and low for it. You may not think this is a big deal but it had at least $150 because my husband and I just drop change in this big jar to deposit in our children's savings accounts every once in a while. I hated to think that it was the nanny but there really was no other explanation. When the nanny was offered employment, she agreed to clean once per week while my kids were in school. Today was her day to clean and everyone was gone. There was a smaller change jar on my bedroom dresser which I decided I would "set up" hopefully in an effort to disprove my suspision that it was the nanny. When I came home and checked the change jar, sure enough the 8 quarters that I strategically placed at the top of the jar were gone. I know it is only $2 but it simply gave me the proof that I needed because in my gut, I knew something was wrong. So, I appreciated this blog because it helped me realize that I need to sit down and confront her to see what she has to say. I would have been happy to give her a raise or a pay advance had she told me that she was having financial difficulties. I feel the trust has been broken and I cannot trust her to care for my kids anymore.
With respect to the clothes, I think the trust has been broken there as well mostly because of the elaborate lying that took place. Had she simply told you the truth with the clothes when asked, I'm sure you would have understood but the fact that she made up lies really does question her integrity. Perhaps in this case you might be able to salvage the relationship but you won't know that until you get this off your chest and have a sit down talk which I'm sure you have already done since this posting is a month old. MR
Previously being a nanny myself, I know how trust is a very important part of the relationship.
I would sit down with your nanny, tell her you found out and that you no longer feel you can trust her and that you are letting her go.
That is just plain unacceptable in my eyes that any nanny would do that!
I would be insulted that she feels like she has to sell clothes to make more money... I mean you are already paying her a salary!?!
I agree with a previous poster... if you can find out how much she made, I would make her donate the money to the charities. :)
Follow your gut feeling, if you feel that she cannot be trusted, you are probably right. If you cant trust her with some old toys and clothes, how can you trust her with your children??? Finding a new nanny may be a bit of a bother and take a while, but is it not worth the time and effort knowing that you can trust the person who is looking after your children?
I have had an experience where I had a nanny that had all the right qualifications, but I still found that something about her seemed off, though I could not put my finger on it. People around me kept saying that she was a great candidate and I listened to them and hired her. After a very short time things started to go wrong. She never harmed my child, but she did make numerous other mistakes, including putting pictures of my home(whom I had taken myself!)and writing about my child and family in her blog (that I stumbled over by chance...), for the world to read.
The point is that if it feels wrong, it probably is, no matter what. Listen to your gut feeling, not to others.
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