I will be seeking a new job in a few months and want to be "on the books". I
have only nannied while in college and was seeking part time jobs and was
shocked at how much aversion the families I met had to paying taxes. During one
particular search I interviewed with THREE families that seemed like good fits.
The first two ended the interview and said they "could not afford" to pay taxes.
One tried to convince me I didn't need to pay taxes. The other reacted as if I
just told them I'd have their toddler drive the family car. The third family
also had an excuse but by then I was without work for so long and just so worn
out that I just accepted.
How many of you parents and nannies with full time arrangements pay taxes? How
and when do I bring this up in a professional manner? Is there anything I should
watch out for (besides being suckered into being an "independent contractor")?
Thanks everyone
Make it a non-negotiable if it's important to you. You have the law on you side, at least.
ReplyDeleteWell...our nanny is on the books. However, it is a LOT of work on our part and a lot more expense that even just the taxes. First off, there is the fact that if you need to net a certain amount, then they will have to increase your pay to get to that amount. And that isn't a small amount. It is roughly $2/hr, which adds up quickly. In addition, we pay employer taxes that equals roughly $150 a month. Also, because we want to make sure we are doing everything correctly, we use a nanny payroll service, which is another $50/month. This is money we pay out that our nanny never sees. There is also the added burden of being audited (we have already been audited twice in the two years we have employed our nanny). Also, once you are on the books, you have to keep hours to 40 and must pay overtime when you go over 40 hours. This again adds to our expenses (though at least that hits our nanny's check). Finally, because we are on the books, our homeowners insurance requires us to carry L&I, which is another $600 a quarter. All of this to say, recognize what you are asking a family to do in terms of extra expenses and paperwork. You might have to take that into account when negotiating your hourly rate, as the family might truly NOT be able to afford to pay enough pretax to get you what you want to net.
ReplyDeleteAll of that being said, I do believe it is important to pay our nanny on the books. Our nanny and her husband recently purchased a home and she couldn't have helped with the finances if she did not have her pah history with us. Also, I believe that receiving a check via direct deposit and having the daily time records help keep us all in track and lend a professional feeling to the relationship. Just be aware of what doing things legally requires your employers to do and that you could potentially end up with less in your pocket.
I would just tell any prospective employer that it is nonnegotiable that you be paid over the table. You recognize the costs that will add to their expenses and are willing to agree to a fair pretax hourly rate that meets everyone's needs.
I pay taxes. It's not cheap, but hiring private care a private employee is not cheap. It's a luxury in my opinion if you can't afford to do it right according to the law you can seek other forms of childcare.
ReplyDeleteAs others have said make it non negotiable. Sometimes it helps to mention that they can receive child care credit by being on the books.
Do not let them guilt you or manipulate you into a lower salary than you deserve. Again having a nanny is costly. If you don't want to pay they can look elsewhere.
I also suggest looking with an agency. I find most agencies and parents hiring through an agency understand the expense of a nanny and paying taxes.
Don't back down!
Been there...at this point in my life I need to be paid on the books. Period. Some families do argue that they can afford to pay you more under the table, and back when I was only working as a part time nanny that was ok. But now that this is my full time position, I want this done the right way. Be up front and firm...some families will feel the same way you do. It may take a bit longer to find them but it will be worth it.
ReplyDeleteSince this is very important to you OP, then during your initial phone conversation w/any prospective families, let them know right off the bat that you want to work "on~the~books." Those that way you will not have to waste any time on a family that does not see things your way.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I agree that going through a Nanny agency would probably be your best route for families that pay taxes.
Good Luck!~
We gave our nanny the choice. We pay her off or on the books, but we aren't going to pay more. She gets $20/hr (for two kids, one of whom is in school most of the time she is here) and that is it (not counting overtime, but that is rare). So she can get that in cash and earn $20 an hour or she can be paid via payroll and net whatever the is after taxes. She (not surprisingly) took the cash option. We own our own small businesses and already have payroll set up, so she can change her mind at any time she chooses (we just need a few days notice). This is our third nanny in eight years and they have all chosen the cash.
ReplyDeleteI don't think a family is obligated to pay more so that a nanny can net a certain amount. That isn't reality. Do not get me wrong here. Employers absolutely should absolutely pay a fair wage, but taxes are what taxes are and it will hit a nanny's bottom line just like it does mine. I prefer that money go to my nanny; she deserves it.
PARENTS who refuse to pay taxes act like they are doing you a favor. The reality is they are doing only themselves a favor. Yes, you might take a little bit more home now, but unless you are investing it in a high risk/high yield investment, whats the point> You have no social security and never mind, eventually the irs will catch up with you and who will they come for? you. I cant stand people for long so I move around a lot. One of the things I like to blackmail families with on exit is the fact that they could go to federal prison for their tax evasion. I always get info to back it up.
ReplyDeleteBlackmail? Can't stand people? Move a lot? Don't you sound like a quality nanny!
DeleteIf you didn't report your income and pay the appropriate taxes, you would be in just as much trouble as your employers if you decided to turn them in. Ignorance is no excuse to the IRS.
this country is broke because of all the rich fuckers who don't pay taxes on their employees. they pay their handymen, landscapers, nannies and housekeepers under the table. these people then go and get foodstamps, section 8, welfare, scholarships and state insurance.
ReplyDeleteI think we could turn the economy around if we opened up a hotline where people got $250 for turning in a genuine tax evader (providing enough proof to start an investigation)
There are so many illegals in Greenwich. The one who lives underneath me gets disability, but all he does is play soccer all day long.
If all nannies insisted on being paid on the books, then some of us wouldn't be left in the gutter..
Anonymous- do you give yourself a BIG pat on the back for doing what you're required by law to do? It sounds like it's such a hardship for your family! My goodness your greedy nanny! How kind of you to do what you're required by law to do so that she can also be a participating member of society and buy a house! Your tone was so full of self pity...if you can't afford to employ someone legally, you can't afford to employ them. PERIOD! Stop whining and feeling sorry for yourself. A nanny is a luxury.
ReplyDeleteOh, please Nanny S. I've seen your griping and whining on this board for as long as I've been reading. OP asked about how she can get paid on the books, so I was letting her know why most families AND nannies prefer to do it off the books. It is a lot of work to do things legally and everyone ends up with less, including our nanny! The system is broken to the point where it encourages even honest people like my husband and I to do things dishonestly. We do it by the books because we are decent, honest people who respect our nanny. But the bottom line is that most nannies have NO idea of the work and cost involved behind the scenes and what it truly takes to do it "right". And, though we are legally required to pay taxes, we are NOT legally required to pay L&I. That is above and beyond. We are also NOT required to do payroll and offer direct deposit.
DeleteI never said our nanny was greedy, didn't even infer it. I wish all of the extra money we paid out went to HER, rather than insurance, taxes, etc. That is a cost of doing business, I realize, but it is an unfortunate one.
How about you save your sarcasm and disdain for people who aren't doing it by the books? I was just being honest with the OP so she understands both sides of the coin, which can give her some negotiating power when asking to be on the books.
And as a whole other discussion, I disagree vehemently that a nanny is a luxury. Quality childcare should be a right to a children. I would think, as a childcare provider yourself, you would agree that all children should have the very best in care.
Parents who pay off the books and nannies who expect it are crooks. That's all there is to it. They are breaking the law. Good for you OP for wanting to do the right thing.
ReplyDeleteI always remind parents about the childcare tax credit because they can't claim it if they aren't paying your taxes. Keep looking, OP, you'll eventually find someone who wants to do the right thing.
PS: having a nanny absolutely is a luxury, not a right. Yes, all parents have the right to quality childcare but nannies are not the only way to achieve this, they are simply the most expensive way. Plenty of daycares (corporate and at-home) are good quality.
A nanny isn't a luxury? What planet do you live on? Quality childcare is, interestingly enough, only owed to a child by their parent. Sure all children should have the best care. I am in no way obligated, or even find it the slightest bit appealing to provide it without being compensated a livable salary and having access to basic employee rights like every other working American. Please.
ReplyDeleteThough I definitely don't agree with blackmailing a family at all, just an FYI, feds tend to go after the employers and business owners and leave the employee alone.
ReplyDeleteNOT true. Last year my employers were turned in by a neighbor during a neighborhood dispute. I had to pay my taxes back on a payment plan. It sucked. So dont think it won't happen to you.
DeleteSo it has happened AGAIN. I interviewed with a family yesterday and toward the end of the interview they wanted to discuss wages and benefits. I said I would not consider a position that wasn't over the table. Their faces dropped. They solemnly told me it was too expensive for them and too much of a "hassle". I am getting worn down again. Full time nannies who work under the table--how do you file your taxes? I am not married and don't know how to navigate this. What other options do I have?
ReplyDeleteGreat advice @DadBoss.
ReplyDeleteYou sound like a fair employer.
Bring it up early before you waste your time or try a nanny agency.
ReplyDelete