Help! The father in the family has a crush on me, he is always flirting. I'm not interested and never flirt back and he gets pissed off when he flirts and I don't flirt back. I like the job, the mother is great, the kids are great, the pay is great. I don't know what to do about him. This is my first job. I just graduated high school and I don't want to be a quitter. My dad will be disappointed if I quit.
Your dad won't be disappointed if his daugher quits because she is being sexually harassed by an older man. He would prob be pissed at your boss.
ReplyDeleteQuit and find a new family.
Ugh what a scum bag!! Quit ASAP!
ReplyDeleteI am sorry to tell you this, but you only have one option here OP...QUIT!! What this Father is doing is creating an extremely uncomfortable work environment for you and he is also sexually harassing you. You are very young and it grosses me out that this Father is flirting w/you. You deserve better.
ReplyDeleteDon't worry about your own Father. Once you tell him the reason for your departure, he will surely understand.
I recommend leaving immediately from this job. Giving the standard 2-week notice may create a hostile work environment and since the Father will know you are leaving, who knows what he may try? Stay safe and leave ASAP!!!!!!
Please keep us posted on what happens.
Best of luck to you.
well it depends on what he is doing. If he talking to you and joking with you he may just be talking to you and joking with you. And he may think you are rude for not talking to him. I know a lot of women who think men are flirting with them when they aren't. Just because a man is nice to you doesn't mean he is flirting with you. I would need more details as to what he says and where he stands in accordance to you
ReplyDeleteRegardless of Phoenix's constant insisting that men are just misunderstood, and shame on women for being appalled by what we deem as their inappropriate behavior.... my 2 cents is this: If YOU are uncomfortable, YOU should leave. It doesn't matter what HIS intent is/isn't. That's not for US to determine. Follow your heart. Dad will understand.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jersey- if you are feeling uncomfortable with how this father is interacting with you, trust your gut and move on.
ReplyDeleteYou don't need Phoenix to make a determination regarding whether he is indeed sexually harassing you. Trust your instincts as you are the only one directly in that situation.
OP, when I was about your age I got my first job at a fast food place. I was quite "well-developed" physically and my boss quickly began to schedule me on shifts where it would just be him and I closing.
ReplyDeleteI was naive and sheltered and not assertive, which he took advantage of to fondle me. One night he coerced me into giving him a blow job.
I was devastated and the very next morning could only tell my parents that I wanted to quit immediately. They never asked any questions, but the truth is that I thought they would blame me. I thought it was all my fault for letting it happen, when in fact it was just that I was too young and inexperienced to know how to "say no" to an authority figure.
If that is what you are thinking, please reconsider your situation. If your father knows the truth, he will NOT blame you. This is NOT your fault. You will NOT be "a quitter".
Get out before this kills your soul like it did mine. This happened to me 35 years ago and to this day my parents still have no idea because I have chosen to carry the indignity and humiliation to my grave.
Don't let your life become that. Put it out to your parents and trust that they will come to your defense.
It's okay for you to quit. Quit now!
ReplyDeleteMy dad sounds a lot like your's and if my dad found out I quit because my boss was harrassing me he not only wouldn't care but would probably go and kick the guys ass in.
What a sicko. I'm sorry this is happening to you.
If you know you're being harassed, and of course you are the one who knows, get out before it escalates.
ReplyDeleteYou DO NOT have to give us the details.
ReplyDeleteIf YOU feel he is making YOU uncomfortable you have every right to quit.
I highly doubt this is just a case of a friendly older guy. This is a young ineperienced girl and I'm sure he knows eactly what he's doing.
I wouldn't too worry much about your dad. If he knows why you quit I'm sure he'll back you.
I'll give you the parent perspective on this: there is no way I would be upset if my daughter quit a job because her safety was being threatened.
ReplyDeleteDon't go back just quit. If you're working with an agency I would tell them about his behavior.
hey I was just offering an alternative. She obviously doesn't want to quit so its best to take a step back and analyze before working off of raw emotion. he may make her feel uncomfortable but he may not know it. Men don't pick up sublte queus in conversation. They just aren't that obserbvant. Some men joke about things they shouldn't around some women.
ReplyDeleteThen there is the case that he is actually doing this on purpose. Then you quit. No questions asked, give no notice and don't tell the wife why if you don't want to. You should never feel like a victim around ANYONE male or female. It isn't right and you can quit without notice for it.
And if a man coerced a woman and she went with it...well it my world that is called a simple minded female. being young and vulnerable is no reason to be weak. The two don't go hand in hand. Being young and vulnerable shouldn't make anyone a victim. If a man hurts you it should be by force. You tried your hardest to fight the good fight. but never "tricked" sorry that doesn't ring logical in my book.
or simply tell the dude you have a boyfriend (even if you don't) most men don't like the competition factor. I say most only because there are the rare few you actually like that. Most of my friends are men. They treat me like "one of the guys" so I know every little dirty way they think. Sex is on the top of that list. but there are some good men out there who value monogomy.
ReplyDeleteKiddo, you have got to learn the difference between "being a quitter" and "taking care of yourself". IF a job makes you uncomfortable, unhappy*, or scared for your safety, LEAVE IT.
ReplyDeleteYou are 18 years old. You shouldn't consider any job that will damage your back, your hearing, or your joints. You should also leave or decline ANY job where someone is making you uncomfortable in any way. Guess which one this is?
Quit without notice. DO NOT tell MB why you are quitting; she will blame you. Make vague allusions to family issues and STICK TO YOUR GUNS. MB may try to re-negotiate your salary, your hours, or something in the reasonable belief that you aren't happy with the job. It'll break your heart but you MUST repeat, calmly and simply, that you cannot work for them anymore and you wish them (well, her and the kids) the best.
If your father expresses disappointment about your quitting, look him right in the eye and tell him DB was being inappropriate. If he tries to rationalize it like Phoenix did (sorry, honey, I usually agree with you but not this time), tell him it was your job and it's your gut and you know you did the right thing. If he still doesn't get it, TOO BAD. DO NOT allow him to make you feel bad about this. Refuse to discuss it. You're an adult, you make your own employment decisions now.
This is where you learn how not to be taken advantage of. Don't screw it up; it gets harder and harder to learn the older you get.
*I mean like REALLY REALLY soul-sucking pit-of-despair unhappy, not "blegh I don't want to go to work today I'd rather sleep late and read and take a walk" unhappy.
I agree with the majority of posters, but have one thing to add: this DB does not have a "crush" on you. Please change your though process on this.
ReplyDeleteHis intent has nothing to do with how much he likes you, how likeable you are, or how worthy you are for being liked. Do not mistake his interest for validation or even mis-guided affection.
His interest is because he senses a vulnerability in you that he would like to exploit. Use. Take advantage. Period.
And he knows that if he is successful, you will blame yourself, etc. etc. and there will be little repercussions for him.
He thinks he is a smooth operator, but he is a pig. And you do not have the confidence or experience to deal with him. Quit. He can be someone else's problem.
Your Dad will understand, because your Dad knows your worth, and that your worth is so much more than this pig deserves.
Best to you, OP. You don't have to put up with this crap.
or stop being vulnerable. i don't quite understand why you cant tell him to fuck off (if he is flirting)
ReplyDeletei've always had men at my jobs flirting with me. no take that back all out bluntly asking me out and constantly following me around. If I felt threatened by their behavior I tell them that if they don't leave me alone I will make them eat their own balls. And The day i did that I brought a recorder so "outside" parties knew it was him not me coming on to him.
I don't understand vulnerability in women. I really don't. Even one girl I knew who had a very tragic start to her life doesn't act this way around men. I've seen her sock one in the adams apple.
Wow Phoenix. Just wow.
ReplyDeleteyeah. I realize that bluntness isn't that well received here but it isn't time to sugar coat things. This is a serious situation. She needs to make sure she isn't reading it wrong and if she is right about him coming on to her. Give him the finger and leave.
ReplyDeletethe only reason she needs to be double sure is because she doesn't want to leave. this is a good job aside from this man.
Phoenix I just hope you never volunteer as a rape crisis counselor.
ReplyDeleteI think for some, Phoenix's message can be very empowering. However Phoenix, some people aren't as strong-willed as you. I'm an incredibly independent person as well, but I have friends who don't like to make waves or who grew up in households that taught them that they were somehow to blame for their misfortunes/somehow less valuable than their counterparts. I know you don't understand, because it's not your nature to be vulnerable, but there are plenty of women out there who really, honestly just don't know any differently. Or who cope with their problems in a different way. I, for example, don't mind confrontation, but if I don't like someone's attitude or if I had some guy harassing me at work, I'd alert HR. If he groped me, I wouldn't threaten to kick his balls in, I just would.
ReplyDeleteOP, you're young, impressionable, and vulnerable. The father senses that, and if you don't analyze whether or not you feel comfortable standing up to him or drawing your line in the sand, then you should quit.
I agree with Phoenix to a point, but learning how to shut down a pig or a predator is a process that happens over time - it's not something you "decide to do" and become proficient in overnight.
ReplyDeleteAlso, keep in mind that a nanny job is a unique employment situation, and if the OP does NOT handle it successfully, it is lose-lose for her. AT least if she quits before any real confrontation she can leave with her dignity.
And if a man coerced a woman and she went with it...well it my world that is called a simple minded female. being young and vulnerable is no reason to be weak. The two don't go hand in hand. Being young and vulnerable shouldn't make anyone a victim. If a man hurts you it should be by force. You tried your hardest to fight the good fight. but never "tricked" sorry that doesn't ring logical in my book.
ReplyDeleteYup. Being young and vulnerable doesn't necessarily make you a victim, but it DOES mean that you lack the actual life skills needed to deal with a situation like this. We are not born with the ability to deal with perverts, we need to acquire them as we grow up.
The ignorant arrogance asserted in your post is EXACTLY why my teenaged self, raised 35 years ago to NEVER question authority and sheltered from all thing sexual, would NEVER have dared tell my parents why I wanted to quit that fast food job where I was being sexually abused and intimidated.
Telling a young girl who has not been raised to feel empowered and taught how to deal with abuse like this -- "grow a backbone and tell him to fuck off" -- may make you feel like hot shit. Congratulations.
However, it does not in fact equip that young girl with actual tangible life skills. It simply reinforces her internal dialogue that she is somehow lacking and therefore deserves such abuse.
think this through..
ReplyDeleteExactly!! THANK YOU!!
Thinkthisthrough - that was perfectly put.
ReplyDeletePhenoix is a fucking moron and if she was young and in some slime ball's house bing sexually harassed on the job she kick him in the balls. Tell him he's a disgusting dirty old man (which he is) that this is bullshit and you quit. Speeking from experience he will push you to fuck him or quit the choice is yours. Don't be stupid, trust your gut and get out with you integrity!
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI think a lot of you are totally taking this out of hand. OP in no way gave us the inclination that this guy is some kind of creepy pedo that yall are making him out to be. Yes, she's young but she is in the working world, so she should know how to take care of herself. And if she doesn't, then maybe she shouldn't be working yet and should live on campus or something like that. We don't even know if this man is much older than her. All we know is that he's been "flirting" with her and she doesn't like it. So she has two choices: either tells him to stop or quits. Neither one are that big of deals, really.
ReplyDeleteThis thread has gotten a little more on the topic of female empowerment, which is a good one, because I feel that all women (especially ones in the workforce) should be strong enough to stand up for themselves. To whomever it was that said she was forced to give her boss a BJ: I'm sorry no. Unless he physically held your head down or else threatened you with a weapon, I just can't believe you were forced. No, I can't relate to this, because I have never been raped. Men have tried to abuse me in the past but I have not let them. I stand up for myself and I hate seeing women who are unable to. Quite frankly, those of you who cannot stand up for yourselves make the rest of us look weak and that is the problem.
MissMannah - Thank you. Your comment perfectly illustrated why woman are afraid to come forward and why there is so much shame around sexual harassment/rape/abuse. 1 in 3 women will be sexually assualted in some manner in her lifetime. I'm glad to hear you aren't one of them but I am baffled by your lack of empathy. Sexual harassment by employers is so prevelant because they are in such a unique position of power and control. I'm hoping that OP can leave this job and get support form her family while she finds a new one. She is clearly bothered by this situation and wants honest advice. Not everyone can just walk away from a job if they need it to survive.
ReplyDeleteAt thinkthisthrough - I'm so sorry MissMannah made such an ignorant and hurtful comment towards you. I applaud your honestly and the obvious strides you've made.
ReplyDeletePhoenix,
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me as if you're always giving men a free pass, no matter how dirty they are. Believe it or not, I'm much like you in that I have more male than female friends - women can be catty as hell and men don't usually care for that kind of shit.
However, if a guy is acting like a prick, I won't let him get away with it. You seem to have a bit of a submissive quality about you when it comes to men.
Miss Mannah:
ReplyDeleteDo us all a favor, would you?
Disappear!!
OP, my very first FT nanny job came when I was 19yo. I can't believe how naive I was. About 2mo into it, I had to have dental surgery. The parents were extremely compassionate and said if I would still come to work, I could stay the night. They didn't expect much, just wanted me to be there for the little boy.
ReplyDeleteThe mother worked late nights and the father typically did as well but this night he came home early. I had fallen asleep on the couch because of taking a vicodin. I woke up to his hands under my shirt, fondling me. I froze. I was so scared and didn't know what to do. He ended up raping me. I had only been with one boy before that and we'd dated over a year before we had sex the first time. I left and never went back. I kept that secret for years, never telling a soul until I married my husband.
"And if a man coerced a woman and she went with it...well it my world that is called a simple minded female. being young and vulnerable is no reason to be weak. The two don't go hand in hand. Being young and vulnerable shouldn't make anyone a victim. If a man hurts you it should be by force."
ReplyDeleteFor the love of God, please tell me you didn't just say that Phoenix! You're basically BLAMING the woman if she gets taken advantage of! What is wrong with you?!
@Don't Be a Victim:
ReplyDeleteThat is horrible that the Father did that to you. What a snake!! I think you should have pushed charges against him, but I completely understand why you didn't. Age, fear, inexperience, etc. I am so so sorry that happened to you.
;(
While I usually waste my breath on telling Phoenix and Miss Mannah to go away, I actually kind of like that they continue to make asses out of themselves because the comments from others are quite entertaining to read. Keep being ignorant Phoenix and Mannah! Maybe someday you will get it, but until then I will sit back and enjoy watching everyone else on this blog make you out to be the true assholes that you both are.
ReplyDeleteWhen I was 18 I worked in a grocery store produce department.There was a super slime ball store manager that was engaged to be married and about 38. A lot of the young girls fawned over him for reasons I cannot understand and gave him the attention he sought. One day I was working alone in the freezer room getting watermelons and plums.He came in from what seemed like no where and asked me why I worked here and not Hooters. He made comments about my breasts and was basically being filthy. I was appalled.I told him I had a boyfriend,(I didn't) he persisted and said I could make some "extra" cash right now if I wanted. I got out of the freezer room asap and basically told him to kindly F**k off.The next morning I was working early he was also there. I was still totally unsettled about the night before. He told me I was out of the produce dept and onto a register because I didn't do my job well! He took me into the office to tell me this alone of course and told me that I could always go work at a strip club called "Cinderellas" and proceeded to give me directions to it. I collected myself told him I was calling the union. I told my department manager and she was shocked,she got me the union number and they came right away!He lied and said I had a screaming fit and called him racial slurs! He was however promptly transferred,and I NEVER had to see him again. Moral of the story nip things in the bud. He didn't like me (ughhh so gross) wanted an easy fling with an 18 year girl who wasn't experienced with these types of things yet.I was home schooled and super easy prey lol! Who ever said on here we're not born with perv coping skills was right,but I will say once you've dealt with one, you've dealt with most.This guy was just the first. Chin up young Padawan! My mom was a monster growing up and when I told her about what had happened she was surprised I hadn't quit. I will say though I was proud of myself for not quitting and handling the situation the best I could. I went on to work there/nannying for 5 years through college.
ReplyDeleteAND of course being a young women is no reason to weak or vulnerable, which is why I assume OP came here for advice. Sometimes we just need a little encouragement to make the decision we know we need to. Whether it be a verbal "shove off" or a physical one. Safety in numbers. :)
ReplyDeletePhoenix- because someone does not think the way you do or respond to a situation the way you would does not make them wrong. You come on this board trying to portray yourself as some sort of expert in any area that is being discussed, and yet you seem to have little insight into how ignorant you sound. Blaming thinkthisthrough for what was done to her is crossing the line, however. MissMannah you also have some nerve.
ReplyDeletei am an asshole and I don't give two flying fricks about how people feel about me. but I don't let people take advantage of me. And it wasn't a learned behavior. I've been like that since a child.
ReplyDeleteI guess I don't understand weak. Looking back I wasn't a very nice child. I think I may have run a mini gang in 3rd grade. There was the girl who wanted to be my friend so bad and hang out with all the people who followed me around. She would draw me pictures and go out of her way to do things for me. I know that once I called her picture as ugly as she was then tore it up. Looking back I feel kinda bad about that. I thought about that last weekend. I was always this way. Not going to apologize for it or change the way I approach life or people. So get used to it and save your breath. i'm a born asshole.
Phoenix you are a legend in your own mind.
ReplyDeletewell I thought i'd save people the trouble. you can't tell someone they are an asshole if they already know it and accept it about their personality. It is like telling me I have red hair. Duh, i know that.
ReplyDeleteSave it
You are the only person here calling yourself an asshole, fyi.
ReplyDeleteYou are being called out for saying some ignorant, judgemental things on this board. My sense about you is that you are starved for attention, as most of these comment threads seem to wind up being about you in some way. This is a pattern, and where there's smoke, well, you know the rest.
@Phoenix:
ReplyDeleteYour posts are so darn long that I usually skim over them since they go off-topic and all.
How in the world do you find the time to post such LONG posts? Do you even work??
I cannot find enough hours in the day to post as much as you do.
Aregular - you couldn't be more spot on. Despite all her bravado, Phoenix seems to be a profoundly insecure and unhappy individual. Maybe she thinks if she says the same things often enough and loud enough, they will become true. Hopefully she'll reach a place of acceptance in her own life. Maybe then she'll have better things to do than vying for attention and mocking rape victims.
ReplyDeletethat is what I hope. Talk some sense into people. no I was called an asshole. re-read other people's posts. And the term ignorant. Pot kettle black much?
ReplyDeleteand i type such long posts because I can actually type incredibly fast. If it took me forever to type I would never get done with my novel. It doesn't take a genius to learn to use a keyboard. i am sorry some of you have such difficulty.
Phoenix, I think there's something more going on here with you. I see you think of yourself as a strong female in some respects and yes, you take an awful lot of abuse on this blog for your behavior. Personally, I don't have a problem reading your comments, as they always offer a differing view point for the others, but I seriously think you have a sensitivity chip missing. I'm not saying this to be mean myself, but am hoping you'll hear me out and just bring the tone down a bit.
ReplyDeleteYour attitude and comments towards the women here that have come forward concerning sexual abuse is beyond demeaning. Please try to put yourself in their shoes and be more understanding. Sometimes I feel bad for you when I see so many people flaming you and I don't care what you say, it's got to sting just a little.
I'm not asking you to change who you are - just to please be a little more kind in your response on more sensitive issues.
MissMannah, I am pretty appalled by the following:
ReplyDelete"To whomever it was that said she was forced to give her boss a BJ: I'm sorry no. Unless he physically held your head down or else threatened you with a weapon, I just can't believe you were forced. No, I can't relate to this, because I have never been raped. Men have tried to abuse me in the past but I have not let them. I stand up for myself and I hate seeing women who are unable to. Quite frankly, those of you who cannot stand up for yourselves make the rest of us look weak and that is the problem."
Tell me, do the same rules apply to children? To women who have a family they need to feed and who can't find a job in a different place? To women who simply feel deeply threatened by their employer and are afraid to say no for fear of some sort of retaliation?
Phoenix, same questions go to you, based on this comment:
"And I still don't know how anyone can be coerced. Did he drizzle honey on his cock and tell you they didn't have napkins so you had to lick it off?"
Phoenix,
ReplyDeleteMaybe if you slow down your typing you will be able to think beyond your usual self referential smugness.
If all yall will just calm down for a moment and take a deep breath, you would see that Phoenix and I have said nothing about women getting raped deserving it or whatever else you're thinking. I do not believe that, nor did I even imply it. Being "coerced" (whatever the hell that means) to do something is totally different from being held down and forcibly penetrated.
ReplyDeleteRead Beezus's post about how she handled sexual harassment at work. Brava Beezus! You are a strong woman and a commend you for being so level-headed at such a young age.
Tales, you are being ridiculous. Do the rules apply to children? Of course not. I am well aware there are sexual predators out there who will take advantage of children and make do things against their will. You can't honestly think I believe the children should be able to stand up for themselves or that it is in some way the children's fault. Of course not! Or the women who need the job to provide for their families? Do what Beezus did: go to HR and report the asshole! That's what HR is there for! And if you're just plain scared, then you have a personal problem and need therapy. I can't feel sorry for you because you're doing a fine job of feeling sorry for yourself.
Thank you again for the stellar advice MissMannah. We all know that every nanny or even small family company job, comes with an HR department. You are incredibly seperated from reality. If I were your MB I would fire you on the spot. You clearly have no capacity for rational thought or empathy. I would not want you to be the person teaching my child anything.
ReplyDeleteSLNanny, well said.
ReplyDeleteOP: there is no excuse for a grown man to be flirting with his young nanny. If I were you, I would tell my Dad exactly what is going on. You have the right to not feel comfortable at your place of employment.
Wow: the comments on this thread are out of control. Again, I say I am baffled that I am constantly flamed when there are other nimrods on here who sound so ridiculous. I feel I am tame compared to most of them.
**to not feel uncomfortable**
ReplyDeleteyes. people have said that i do have a empathy problem. it depends though. I don't shelter those who put themselves in a situation they have control over. If a woman gets raped it is the worst thing in the world. but if a woman puts herself in a position to be taken advantage of and she doesn't change it. that is an issue. there is a reason I don't drink around men. there is a reason that I don't allow men to be in any position that would even look like there could be anything going on. But i don't take men's kindness as them flirting. Every situation as two sides. We don't know what is really going on. Most women are "sensetive" and they feel threatened by men. I see myself as their equal at all times. I can speak to strange men about sex and give them tips to porn sites and have them dish it out right back to me and never having it be confused. If a man trys to treat a woman as his equal and she thinks its flirting then that is HER problem. Not his.
ReplyDeleteEvery woman has to take care of themselves. No one else is going to do it. But we should know when we are being preyed upon and when we are not. Some men are very open and they joke around with women who are sensetive. This is not the man's fault. He should not be responsible for the woman's feelings. She is responsible for herself. If she acts a victim, she will be treated as such. Not everything is black and white. And not every nice man is flirting. It may feel that way because its a member of the opposite sex but from my experience it has always been the woman's wrong read. Unless of course it is obvious the man is over stepping his bounds. but to automatically take the womans side just because she is the "weaker" sex. That is not logical and frankly quite unfair and a pretty damn big double standard.
And yes logical reason does appear to be a lack of empathy but that is the point. You need to look at a situation without emotion to get the clear picture. In no way am I down playing the plight of an abused female. Simply analyzing a situation effectively requires you to be void of emotion. otherwise it is pointless. I am looking at things from the goggles of a scientist not a woman trying to help another woman. Both sides as equals.
If that is wrong then I don't want to be right
nynanny
ReplyDeletethank you for giving me your opinion in a nice way. You are not wrong. It may seem that I have no emotion but I do that on purpose. My long rant above was just to my point but I wanted to reply to you directly.
I have a good reason for taking emotion out of my problem solving skills. It is so I can determine the "why" behind someone's opinion rather than jumping to the conclusion of the individuals perceived outcome. I do the same thing in my personal life with my friends. Instead of automatically comforting them i walk them through why they have a certain opinion. It helps them to calm down and think and rationalize. if one of my friends came to me and said they were raped or beaten then I grab my husband and we go find the mother fucker. That has happened once. And good for that guy my husband never found him.
drastic actions should only be taken under drastic conditions. If the situation is not life altering there is time to think about things and be smart.
so i am not lacking a sensetivty chip. I just don't use emotion unless I need to. you did not insult me.
also no. it doesn't sting when people flame me. I like a good debate. I honestly should have been a lawyer. I like the fight. Its part of my persona. it's like a boxing match in a way. i take a punch and throw back 5. this really isnt the only place this happens to me. i like it when i have strong personalities to go up against. Umass is one of the stronger women here. i have mad respect for her. she's a good boxing partner. and heavan forbid if MissMannah was on the other end. She might very well take me down!! LOL
ReplyDeletePhoenix,
ReplyDeleteIf you are ever in my town, I would like to buy you a drink. I can't stand you, but I want to hang out with you.
promise you won't sock me when you see me. LOL :)
ReplyDeleteI'm not as bad in person. I'm really quite small. i would for sure take you up on that drink. :)
I don't hit people. I'm a lover, not a fighter.
ReplyDeleteWhy does everyone think lawyers are argumentative? Yes, they have to use words persuasively for a living, but 99% of cases never see the light of a courtroom and most involve persuasive writing, not spoken word. :)
ReplyDeletePhoenix, this comment is a bit hypocritical:
ReplyDelete"if a woman puts herself in a position to be taken advantage of and she doesn't change it. that is an issue. there is a reason I don't drink around men. there is a reason that I don't allow men to be in any position that would even look like there could be anything going on. But i don't take men's kindness as them flirting. Every situation as two sides. We don't know what is really going on. Most women are "sensetive" and they feel threatened by men. I see myself as their equal at all times. I can speak to strange men about sex and give them tips to porn sites and have them dish it out right back to me and never having it be confused."
Having conversations about sex and porn with strange men? Couldn't that be perceived as you putting yourself in a bad situation?
You said in another post you were tiny - what if the guy overpowered you and took advantage of you? You're saying it would then be your fault, right?
You're making me dizzy!
I would leave the position OP, before the dad tries anything on you.
ReplyDeleteDon't worry about your dad. Honestly, if you tell him whats going on he will probably want to beat the crap out of him. My father would do that. Most fathers are very protective of their kids. Yes, I feel like you are still a kid. You are young and he is trying to take advantage of you.
If you worked in an office or somewhere else you could go to HR. You could file a complaint, etc. As a nanny you are more separated and confined. I would be nervous to be in the house with him.
Whatever you do please be careful.
OP
ReplyDeleteI am worried about your situation. I just skimmed over again what you wrote. You mentioned that "he gets pissed off when you don't flirt back".
To me he sounds like he could be dangerous. How do you know next time he will not try to grab and hurt you?
2 Words "Tell Mom."
ReplyDeletePhoenix, go hassle people on another forum. Your writing and your "potty mouth" is uncalled for and unnecessary. Just pack it up and hit the bricks! Jeeze!!
ReplyDeleteI only recently came upon this blog, but have read an awful lot of older posts and the comments that go along with them. Phoenix's comments always cause a lot of eye rolling for me, but this really takes the fucking cake.
ReplyDeletePhoenix, your argument is flawed and I'll tell you why: You believe if a man aggressively pursues and flirts with a woman, doesn't back off and eventually crosses a boundary into sexual assault, the woman is at fault because she didn't manage to stop him? THE GUY SHOULDN'T BE DOING THIS IN THE FIRST PLACE. You're the kind of person who hears about a woman being raped and the first thing out of your mouth is "But wait, what was she wearing?". No matter how slutty a woman acts or dresses, it's not her fault. If she doesn't sock the guy right in the adam's apple the second he starts getting frisky, it's not her fault. Most people do not enjoy confrontation and will try everything in their power to solve an uncomfortable situation without resorting to violence or yelling. Because they don't immediately whip out the "I'm a badass chick" attitude doesn't make them weak.
I'm personally very similar to you, Phoenix. I had a guy get aggressive with me at a bar, punched him in the face and had the bartenders drag him out of there. I don't let people push me around. My mother stressed "Do not let people think you are a victim" and explained even the way you hold yourself and walk will give away whether or not you are someone worth fucking with.
Guess what, I got fucking raped anyway.
I was hanging out with a guy and drinking when we suddenly started to make out. I liked to fool around with a lot of people when I was younger, I'm still a very sexual person, so he thought I was easy and would go further. I declined, but he didn't like that answer. I was shocked that he was holding me down and saying that it was fine. I froze up. All I could do was mumble "No" over and over as he took my clothes off and raped me. I later found out he had given my friend an awful lot of xanax one night and raped her as well. I warned another friend of mine to stay away from him when they started hanging out, but they started dating and lo and behold, he beats the shit out of her and rapes her quite often.
So me and my two friends are at fault? We're normally very strong willed and empowered women, yet this managed to happen to us. This guy who keeps doing this to women isn't to blame because we were 'weak' and stupid for getting fucked up in his presence? A woman shouldn't be allowed to get too drunk because she has to constantly be on the watch for guys like this? Bullshit. Nobody should ever have to change their way of life just to accommodate the shitty behavior of men who feel entitled to what isn't theirs.
Victim blaming is disgusting and your ignorant attitude, Phoenix, perpetuates rape culture. Congrats!
facepalm
ReplyDeleteproblem 1. you put yourself in a vulnerable situation. dont drink with men you dont know well. sorry i dont see that as acceptable. did you knee him in the groin? throw a lamp over his head? did you fight? no you didn't. i feel sorry that happened to you I really do. but it proves my point... i don't drink around men, period, ever. you are right he should have stopped. most men will with a red light but there are men who wont and you dont know which one you got until you know them well enough even if you are married to the guy they can do it. but you cant put yourself in a vulnerable situation. drinking is bad. with your fiend he aparently drugged her and that wasn't her fault if she didn't know she was given the drug. but if she swallowed a hand full of pills...gee dont put the date rape drug in my drink, I will swallow it like a pill. don't worry i will take whatever you give me.
DUMB.
the argument isnt about whether rape is acceptable. IT IS NOT. By no means is it right for a man to sexually exploit and abuse a woman and in no way is it right for a woman to sexually abuse or emploit a man.
ReplyDeleteit comes down to protecting yourself as a human being. if you are presented with a life or death situation you fight to the death, period. I will blame a woman to an extent, not saying she is responsible for the mans actions. That is not feasible. One can't be responsible for others actions no matter how hard we try it can't be done. But steps can be taken to ensure security.
I was jumped by 3 strange men. I don't know what their intentions were but I kicked and screamed and fought to the death. I was beat up and it was awful. Most of the struggling I don't remember but I screamed loud enough for a man to walk by and help me. Now as I replayed that situation I realized that I was not be safe. I didn't take care of myself. I dont blame myself for the attack but I blame myself for not being cautious. Now, I carry a gun with me every where I go. I park in lit areas and I have my head on swivel. Am I paranoid? You bet your ass I am. Being safe is in your own hands. No one elses.
now because people don't know how to use reading comprehension I will say it one more time.
ReplyDeleteRAPE IS BAD. NOT GOOD. HORRIBLE.
If you still think I support the rapists over the victims. i will have to give up on people as a whole. Women are very very good at twisting words so that they appear to be attacks. I don't know how they do it, but it always occurs.
if I say, "such lovely flowers!"
people reply "What?! You don't care about trees! How dare you. There is more to the world than flowers! I have trees and they are important. YOu have insulted my trees! Why are so evil that you don't see the MY trees are important!"
Seriously? That is how stupid most of you are
I hope, OP was able to figure out what to do.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if she'll come tell us considering how this thread has turned out.
hmmmm... it appears i have my first terrorist.
ReplyDeleteso let me understand the logic here.
I was told that I support women being raped and explained logically and nicely that i don't.
then I was told that it was hoped that i and another poster would get raped.
this is the very reason why women can't be in control of the world. They are hypocritical, psychos.
think long and hard about what you say. And think before you speak and take emotion out of your observations.
frankly I don't care if anyone likes me or not. but telling another woman, any woman to get raped is far beyond the evil that even the likes of myself can achieve.
bravo, heartless one bravo
wow girl you are slighty insane. no more convo for you its not good for you. if you let someone you dont know at all create that kind of reaction in you, you give them too much power over yourself.
ReplyDeletei kinda feel sorry for you. in all honesty, like for real
no you didn't hurt my feelings. i was pointing out the hypocritical aspect of your rant. that is still in your statements.
i wont conversate with people who cant debate with me. or with people who have the intelligence of a blade of grass. i'm sorry you dont know how to have a smart conversation. but no matter, your comment will most likely be deleted. so it means not anymore invisible one
Conversate is not a word. The word would be converse.
DeleteTPhoenix telling another woman, any woman that she is to blame for getting raped is an evil far beyond what most people would be capable of. Obviously, though, it's right up your alley. I know you don't have children, but for those of us that do, fighting for life or death takes on a whole new meaning. I am one tough chick who has survived more than most people would guess. When I was raped, my focus was to survive the situation so I could get back safely to my child. Being raped and all the aftermath was horrible, but leaving my child motherless was not an option for me. Judge away.
ReplyDeletewhy would that be something to judge?
ReplyDeletealso i don't know how you confused my statement that being safe as you can is the same as blaming for a rape. i didn't say that. go back and read it again. three times if you have to. if you as a woman do everything in your power to be safe and you still get caught then what is there to judge. If you just start doing stupid shit that are potentially dangerous situations then yeah you werent being safe.
being stupid isnt helpful. i wont go walk down on the south side of phoenix at 1:00 am. If i did that and got shot, or stabbed then that means my dumb ass was not being safe. i can't blame myself for getting shot but i can blame myself for not doing everything i could to prevent it.
i really can't talk to people who keep trying to read in between the invisible lines of what i say.
if i were to support raping women i would come right out and say it. but i don't. and you cant use the "i have children and you dont bullshit" just because i don't have a child doesnt mean i dont value life and those who are in it.
expand beyond being a woman and look at the bigger picture.
To the freaking idiot who is "get raped:" you are a loser.
ReplyDeletePhoenix: I totally get your point. Victim blaming is a horrible thing to do. Phoenix is just making the point that chicks who get drunk with strange men and fool around with them are sort of dumb and are putting themselves in an unsafe situation.
do they deserve to get raped? no. are they inviting trouble? yes.
of course we should teach our daughters that nobody has the right to violate them. but shouldn't we also teach them common sense, and not to act like sluts? sorry but it's true.
You are a really deluded person. I'm sad for you that feeling superior to everyone else is the only way to make yourself feel validated and valued. Good luck trying convince yourself. I have a wonderful life with people who make me feel loved and valued. I can look myself in the mirror knowing I have done the right things. I really hope one day you find the same level of peace. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to enjoy my whole wonderful world. It's bigger and better then living on a website.
ReplyDeleteIgnore it. Just give him a black stare like you are looking right through him, or better yet, just don't look his way.
ReplyDeleteI think it is important not to acknowledge what he is doing. Once you do, you have to decide on a course of action. Flirt back? No. Threaten to tell MB if he doesn't stop? That could get dicey, real quick. This is a nuclear family. You don't want to be the third party, and once you respond to the behavior, you are. Also, she could call you a liar and fire your (*)(*). If you can't ignore his behavior, then quit.
PS (I hate to bring this up, but I saw a 12 year old recently with her cleavage showing, and she was with her MOTHER.) How are you dressing? Are your breasts covered? How about your stomach? Any short shorts? How about makeup? Do you need to wear any? When I worked in child care, I always wore a long sleeve shirt and long pants. I was a prep, so I wore basically men's white shirts with the sleeves rolled up, and khakis or blue jeans. I think it is professional attire, and discourages that type of behavior.
Phoenix: How in the world do you find the time to write such looong responses???? You say you work, yet I don't know what type of job would allow me so much personal computer time.
ReplyDeleteI think you are lying. You do not have a job...you are a stay-at-home whatever w/all the time you want on your hands.
Your posts are sooo looong. Zzzz......
Off topic but...
ReplyDeleteI can't believe half the posters on this website are actually adults, nor can I believe they actually care for children. It's really frightening!
I can't believe that PhoenIx holds a job either. Her grammar and punctuation are terrible.
ReplyDeleteGet it right,
ReplyDeleteUm, they actually added it into the dictionary because it became so widely used (remember when the word "ain't" used to be forbidden?)
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/conversate?s=t
That's funny I don't know what dictionary you're using but it certainly isn't in mine.
DeletePhoenix, you say you won't debate with people that are as dumb as a blade of grass. Well you're about as dumb as a box of rocks. If you have such a photographic memory, why can't you spell.
ReplyDeleteGot/Get it right,
ReplyDeleteOn-line dictionary keeps up with present word changes/additions. I actually saw on the news last week that it will be included in the next Webster's Dictionary printed Edition, lol.
I know, I cringe when I hear it, too!
Here is Merriam/Webster on-line, they've included it, too:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conversate
It is sad to me that in this day in age women still believe that other women invite unwanted sexual advances by their
ReplyDeleteattitude
demeanor
attire
What gives a guy ( or gal) the right to hit on you? It seems as though OP has made it clear she's not interested. Hence " he gets pissed off ehen I don't flirt back"
I would quit and right away. If this was another position I would encourage you to speak with HR.
As a nanny with what I assume is a work at home dad your in a rough spot.
If you are with an agency I would inform thrm of the situation. This shouldn't go undocumented.
Who are any of you to judge if a victim fought back hard enough?
ReplyDeleteWishing rape on someone?
I am honestly appalled.
What in the flaming hell!
According to the above, Phoenix thinks like a scientist, should have been a lawyer, "conversates" on a higher level than all others here, and is some sort of master-fighter.
ReplyDeleteNarcissist more like.
Also, she's writing a novel, is some sort of psychic, and is a super ninja who fights of three huge men at once! She's truly amazing.
ReplyDeletePhoenix also claims to have "extremely attractive" husband.
ReplyDeleteIt's funny how Umass and Phoenix always defend each other.
Sorry Phoenix. A novel? About what? Are you dipping into the "mommy porn" genre?
ReplyDeleteI don't always defend Phoenix at all. I have made it clear in many posts that I disagree with her, for example her views on smoking pot. I will defend anyone's point of view if I agree with it.
ReplyDeleteI can't stand Phoenix. But at least she posts as the same moniker all the time and stands up for her own opinion. Even though her opinions may be misguided at times. I'd rather hang out with Phoenix than a lot of you losers.
I think UMASSLYTHERIN is about 17. Losers? Not many besides Phoenix would want to hang out with you,so take your cliquey self off that laptop and go hang out with your kids. House frumps like you are so freaking obnoxious.
ReplyDeleteOh wow. I'm gonna have to go slit my wrists now. Some nameless faceless loser on the internet just insulted me. lol
ReplyDeleteUmass, I have to agree with you on that one. Who are all these morons posting under fake monikers? It's like they're coming out of the woodwork just to be annoying.
ReplyDeleteThe three of us should get together for beers sometime and argue politics. :)
PS: I've never heard of a 17-year-old house frump before. That's a new one.
lol@17 year old housefrump.
ReplyDelete:)
MissM, I'll buy the first round lol
Well you actually "insulted" all besides Phoenix by calling everyone i.e (a lot) "losers". So I guess we can all slit our wrists in unison due to YOUR lofty insult. Hanging out with those kids yet? Mothers Day is tomorrow:)
ReplyDeleteAsphincter says what?
ReplyDeleteThis comment thread has been awesomely bad and sort of intriguing to follow.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I would love to witness what a political discussion between you ladies would be like...
ReplyDeleteI for one do not hide behind fake monikers I speak my mind. At 47 years old I have decided I will not make time for jerks. You can't fix stupid!
ReplyDeleteAsphincter says what?
ReplyDeleteUMasss...lol! I say that all the freaking time. i luv it that you said that.
I do have a job. I have masters of accountancy. shall i post a pic of it? It is not my problem if you people have never met a person like me.
first of all i didn't say I was a ninja who fought off 3 men. I said i tried and they held me down and a stranger passed and helped me.
I can't teach you all to read, I'm sorry.
my novel though is a paranormal romance novel. I won't discuss the book yet because it is still in the making. Im not comfortable discussing details.
I am so happy that Umass was able to read and use her mind to understand the point i was trying to make. Women should be safe, period.
I actually do have access to a computer at work that does allow me on this site. it blocks a lot of my other ones so that may have something to do with me choosing this site because its the only one i can get on to.
and there is a difference between being cocky and being confident. I am confident and i stick by my ideals. i wont apologize for that. UMass doesn't always agree with me. In fact we don't agree on much but like me she sticks to her ideals and that is honorable. She doesn't hide who she is and she doesn't give conflicting messages. MissMannah and ericsmom are the same. Being strong and sticking up for what you believe in is not something to hold against a person. I don't have actual hate for anyone on this blog. I would never waste my time. i don't think bad about anyone. Why would i? It is merely a different opinion and it is unfair to pass judgment over that.
Grow up and understand they are just different opinions.
Thanks Phoenix
ReplyDeleteI wish I had as much confidence as you.
Now I don't agree that anyone deserves to be raped. BUT Phoenix did have a good point. One poster mentioned about hanging out with the guys and getting drunk and basically acting a fool. Well why would you put yourself in that situation time after time? You really do need to watch who you keep company with.
When Phoenix called her out on it, everyone jumped down her throat.
We all have our own opinions. If everyone would just realize that instead of attacking others on here.
This is sexual harrassment. Plain and simple. Time to leave. Don't let this asshole think he can get away with treating people like that.
ReplyDelete